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NC700X Hard to Start Intermittently

It's all about specification, not brands...

The required oil specs by Honda for NC are:

4-stroke oil
API service classification: SG or higher (except oils labeled as energy conserving on the circular API service label)
JASO T 903 standard: MA
Viscosity: SAE 10W-30 or 10W40
 
While 20w-50 is not the correct oil. I really doubt it's the cause of long crank or slow to start. Maybe slow crank when really really cold and the battery is low. With a reasonable temperatures, strong battery and fuel injection I put the oil way way down on the list. If the problem is new ........I would try new gas before the oil. As for mechanical issues ......tight valves would be high on the check list.

It was not all that long ago 20-50 was the oil of choice across the board. Many air cooled bikes still use it. Honda XR's and bikes like the Transalp used it for years. Transalp are known to use oil at high speed and high outside temps. 20-50 was used to control that oil consumption. Those bikes start just fine and they are carb and choke.
 
It could also be a little bit of everything- sometimes all the miniscule tolerances add up to a +/- stack one way or the other

-teensy weensy fuel pump pressure leak down percentage
-thicker, more viscous oil
-gasoline that has dropped in octane
-a bit of deposits on spark plugs
-spark plugs juuuust a bit out of gap
-intake valves juuuust a bit loose or tight

etc., etc. It may not be a single thing to focus specifically on, or worry unduly about.

Many bikes I've owned have never liked starting on the first button push, but always on the second. Who knows, lol
 
I've had the same problem about 1 out of 20 times for over a year. New battery last week. No different. Always starts, but worries me if I'm away from home.
 
Hi. i´m from Chile, and i´m experiencing the same problem, i think that could be the Gas quality, but i change the gas station and the problem is still here.

Someone found the origin of this issue??

Cheers!
 
If I remember correctly .......there was one post on hard starting ( long crank time) and the fix was either the intake air temp ( IAT) or coolant temperature sensor ( ECT)was off spec. But it did NOT throw a code or check engine light.

Dealer scan tool could check the sensor values or you ohm check the sensors against the chart in the shop manual. Or compare reading to a known good bike.
ECT standard ohm value is 1.0-1.3 Kohm at 104*F which is a weird temp value but that's what the book says. Page 4-19

Or measure sensor out put voltage value with key on engine off which should be 2.8 to 3.0 volts at 70* F. These are general specs. Or again compare to known good bike.

Caution......if your NOT comfortable doing these tests ........STOP.......doing the wrong test or wrong technique could cause BIG Problems that might be far worse than the existing issue plus prove costly $$$$.
 
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Krampus said:
Seemingly not. This machine seems very sensitive to battery condition and charge though. At 12.4V steady state (not with ignition on mind you), I started to have hard starting. Cheers.
Click to expand...
12.4V indicates a weak battery. At 12.5V a Yuasa AGM battery (the numbers can be different in other brands & battery types) can hold only half of its named capacity which is the useful capacity of a lead acid battery. Bellow that, especially in cold, the battery should be replaced if you don't like bad surprises...
 
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Thanks A LOT for your info guys! Im away from home now, so just will pray in order to the motorcycle start when go way to home haha, will check the bike in home. Hope can solve this ballbreacker issue.
 
Today, after 500 km´s weekend trip, my bike start normally way to work :confused: ...i´m using a gps tracker that allways drain the battery, and my conmmuting route as 20 minutes way to work, and 20 minutes way to home (-+10 min.).
so, its a possibility that the battery was too low before my trip.
i will have the bike under observation, if i have any clue of the origin of the problem, will post the info.
Cheers!

Edit:
i forgot to say it, I checked the battery voltage (After trip), and the values are:
Steady no Ignition: 12.8 (with acerbis handguard with led light´s, always on)
Steady W/ Ignition: 12.5
Cranking: 10.x
Ps. Hi Old Can Ride! i think that i readed you in another forum.
 
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Any device that stays on with the key off is a potential problem. Also a 20 minute commute depending on conditions may not be enough to recharge the battery.
 
In general, 15 m. to 20 m. are required to fully charge a battery, much more than 20'. With similar riding distances & time, it was impossible to fully charge my battery on my NC and my previous tricycle (Piaggio MP3). Sulfation kills my batteries in just 2-3 years... (Remember: Only an always fully charged lead acid battery doesn't suffer by sulfation).

Only LiFePO4 batteries can be fully charged in just 10' - 15' even in city because they can accept massive amounts of current (they've a very small internal resistance compared to lead-acid).

The parasitic draw of a GPS tracker or an alarm is really high for a so small battery, undersized for real life we may tell... (Consider that the usable capacity of lead-acid SLI battery is only the half of its named capacity i.e. 5.5 Ah in our case).

You've to help it with a charger if it's possible...


About the measurements: You must wait at least 2 hours before taking any measurement after a charge because surface charges will alter the real status of the battery.
 
showkey said:
Yes....got that.......but........it's not 70* F or " room temperature " other common temp. Where is 104* common....besides AZ :cool:
Click to expand...

Okay, I see your point. Don't know/recall where it came from, but 100 & 212 (40 & 100C) are the normal temps for fluid viscosity values, too. 100F/40C is 'cold.' :)
 
Thanks Ste7ios... i dont knew about the PB Batteries that just the half capacity are usable (or lead acid, its the same rigth?) ... i think that gps could being discharging the battery, i will check voltage when the problem come back, (i hope never again ;) )
maybe meanwhile could check the current with the motorcycle off... in order to know the parasitic comsumption.

Cheers!
 
Bringing back this older post:

Mine has started to do exactly same thing as trey's orginal post .........long crank, hard starting cold intermittently.
This extended long crank might take two to three attempts to get it started.
Normal starting it states in the first couple of seconds on cranking.
So far this only occurs on the first start of the day.
No other running or drivability issues, mpg has remained normal consistent 65-72 mpg.

Have experienced low battery about 10 days back ( slow crank) . Battery is just short of 5 years old. During long crank the engine is cranking at normal cranking speed.
Resting battery voltage 12.6 volts. After messing around for several minutes completing other tests. 12.9 volts when checked first thing in the morning after sitting for extended periods.
Cranking voltage about 11.5 volts
Charging voltage 14.1 volts

Starting this morning OK. 65* F.

Base values on ECT:
First suspect is the ECT ( engine coolant temp) sensor. So far it's tested ok.
Tested the sensor output the ECU hot 180* ..........about .7 volt . ( Back probing the pink/white wire at the sensor)
Tested the sensor at 200* ........... .5 volts
Sensor output voltage cold 70-75* .........2.8-3.0 volts
Cooling fan cycles at about 200*.
Measure ECT resistance at 104* this morning after starting and running...........1.0k ohms. With connector disconnected As per service manual OK
Sensor resistance at 170* ......... 311 ohms
Measured output voltage at 104* voltage .............reading 2.0 volts.
Temperature is being read with infrared device at the thermostat housing near the ECT. Similar temps confirmed at radiator.

Will continue to check ECT over time.

Update 9-1-17
Last two morning started in the first seconds of cranking
ECT sensor signal voltage 3.2 volts at 52* F. ( normal expected value)
Also checked the connector pin fit of the ECT ......normal tight fit

Update 9-11-17
So like a few others.......the long crank starting problem has "fixed" itself.

Update 09-17-17
Hard start returned this morning. Checked ECT Sensor found it to reading correctly, so in this case so far the cause is NOT the ECT. It's not so bad that in concerned it won't start.
 
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