1st Oil change

[Beemerphile]

Hi Lee
who passed this law and why?

It is the Congress in the US that passes laws. Their stated purpose in this case was to make warranties less one-sided in favor of manufacturers and more enforceable by the Federal Trade Commission in support of customers.

Do we then need a group of legislators to pass such laws to protect the citizens?

There are good laws and bad laws. Since the vast majority of laws are bad, they give the few good ones a bad name. This law does not require a consumer products company to offer a warranty. However, if they choose to offer one, it must have some commonalities in the language.

Is that the government or something else? Or should there be just no governments and the Honda owners be left to do what they wished? What if Honda then sells stuff at very different prices across all states and give different conditions to different owners?

So many people try to position government as yes/no black/white anarchy/totalitarianism. It will never be that way. The best that was ever developed in my view was a national charter that limits the actions of a government. That is what we had. That is what we lost. I don't know that it exists anywhere on the earth at this time.

I am not too familiar with the governance structure in USA.

Don't feel bad, neither are most of our citizens.

 

[duk2n]

It would be called freedom to choose but, as soon as if you don't go to the dealer to do the service you lost the warranty, I can't see the freedom anywhere

 

[michaelks]

Ha ha ha, here not only you have to have all your service done at the authorized dealerships, but you also have to use their oil. If you own a Yamaha and don't use Yamalube, no warranty if something goes wrong with the engine, same with Honda genuine oil. And you also cannot touch the machine with any tool. Those oil changes i had them done at Honda. Oh, and there's also their 'genuine' parts, for example a yamaha 'geniuine' bearing will typically cost five times as much as a top quality skf or timken. AND....guess how much i paid for my bike ? R$ 30.000,00, that's , let me see...14.802 USD. On top of that only one year warranty period.

 

[happy]

It would be called freedom to choose but, as soon as if you don't go to the dealer to do the service you lost the warranty, I can't see the freedom anywhere

Ha ha ha, here not only you have to have all your service done at the authorized dealerships, but you also have to use their oil. If you own a Yamaha and don't use Yamalube, no warranty if something goes wrong with the engine, same with Honda genuine oil. And you also cannot touch the machine with any tool. Those oil changes i had them done at Honda. Oh, and there's also their 'genuine' parts, for example a yamaha 'geniuine' bearing will typically cost five times as much as a top quality skf or timken. AND....guess how much i paid for my bike ? R$ 30.000,00, that's , let me see...14.802 USD. On top of that only one year warranty period.

Best thing is to build your own motorcycle from scratch then?
Or buy a base model (like what Lee did), and make the most out of it and do your own modifications.
Then you can be "free" to do all your own parts and own labour (meaning you do not use genuine Honda parts) and then perhaps you are truly free.
Another way is to ignore that you actually have a warranty.

For the rest of us, we have to rely on Honda to design and sell us a working bike, coupled with some parts compatibility and some workshop restrictions.
They ask you to go back to the Honda agent, perhaps not to get more money from you, but rather to save themselves some, because some DIY folks do screw up and try to claim warranty later on.
I am aware US is big on consumer rights and warranty claims. In the Europe, it is probably the same.

Some will also go back to the Honda garage, just to support the good service the shop gave.
If your shop gives you shit, then find another one.
Being a "honda" agent does not necessarily mean they are cheaters or out to get your money.
They are a business, not a biker's charity.

 

[duk2n]

Best thing is to build your own motorcycle from scratch then?
Or buy a base model (like what Lee did), and make the most out of it and do your own modifications.
Then you can be "free" to do all your own parts and own labour (meaning you do not use genuine Honda parts) and then perhaps you are truly free.
Another way is to ignore that you actually have a warranty.

For the rest of us, we have to rely on Honda to design and sell us a working bike, coupled with some parts compatibility and some workshop restrictions.
They ask you to go back to the Honda agent, perhaps not to get more money from you, but rather to save themselves some, because some DIY folks do screw up and try to claim warranty later on.
I am aware US is big on consumer rights and warranty claims. In the Europe, it is probably the same.

Some will also go back to the Honda garage, just to support the good service the shop gave.
If your shop gives you shit, then find another one.
Being a "honda" agent does not necessarily mean they are cheaters or out to get your money.
They are a business, not a biker's charity.

Sir, yes, sir.

And Spain is in Southamerica, not in Europe

 

[michaelks]

Well, maybe i'm a hopeless romantic, but i like to be in control as far as possible, i like to know my bike, half of my ownership pleasure lies in tinkering, doing my own maintenance - and i suspect most motorcycle owners share this mindframe, are mechanically minded people, so i guess motorcycle manufacturers who keep that in mind will be more successful at the end of the day than those who build black boxes that only they have the tools and the knowhow to service.. BTW, this is one issue i have with the NC, no tecnhical manual, no parts manual, i have no idea where everything is or how to get there. I think a motorcycle is not a car, if all you want is to get from A to B the latter will do it much better and more safely. Again, i am well aware that this isn't how the world spins nowadays, chalk it up to my old age lol.

 

[happy]

Well, maybe i'm a hopeless romantic, but i like to be in control as far as possible, i like to know my bike, half of my ownership pleasure lies in tinkering, doing my own maintenance - and i suspect most motorcycle owners share this mindframe, are mechanically minded people, so i guess motorcycle manufacturers who keep that in mind will be more successful at the end of the day than those who build black boxes that only they have the tools and the knowhow to service.. BTW, this is one issue i have with the NC, no tecnhical manual, no parts manual, i have no idea where everything is or how to get there. I think a motorcycle is not a car, if all you want is to get from A to B the latter will do it much better and more safely. Again, i am well aware that this isn't how the world spins nowadays, chalk it up to my old age lol.

I am guessing you are a big fan, then, of the Harley's. "Simple and idiot-proof" to service.


Black boxes are sometimes better left as blackboxes. Some things are better left to "experts" but finding the right and real experts is the challenge for us mere mortals. Paying a reasonable price when you find them (real experts) should also be part of the deal. More often than not, we think we are cheated (we are) when we pay astrocious prices for poor services.

What some of us can do are limited to
1. oil changes
2. valve checks
3. chain maintenance

Others can go further:
1. airflow mods
2. cylinder rebores
3. exhaust and engine tuning (electronics)
(just some examples, by no means exhaustive list)

and then what else?

There are already NCX service manuals available, search for it in our forum here.
I also believe Honda does not hide their engineering stuff. Even BMWs have to divulge their secrets, etc.

 

[michaelks]

Yes, but sometimes trusting the manufacturer can be downright dangerous - there are no few examples of new motorcycles being delivered with vital parts improperly assembled, loose, etc. One case i can remember among many is the fact that yamaha assembles her bikes with almost no grease on steering and swingarm bearings and links. This is well known and in one reported instance caused a nearly fatal crash when the steering on a 660 XT suddenly seized. Here are pictures of my late XT660 Z's steering stem and rear suspension link bearing, both quite dry when i took them apart brand new for greasing. The maintenance schedule thought a greasing job would only be needed after 25000 km, if i well remember. There would be not much left of those bearings by then.

http://img850.imageshack.us/img850/6922/dsc00519wj.jpg

http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/7232/dsc00473ga.jpg

This is merely to say that, our lives depending on these machines to a far greater extent than in the case of automobiles, we might do well to try to know our machines as much as possible, and would also be entitled to better and more comprehensive user manuals.

 

[fedtech]

dealers also say you can't repair flats too. just use api sg or high nonresource conserving oil and any equivalent oil filter. it has been a long time since i have seen an engine failure due to lubricity. 1989 ford ranger owned by farmer had 58,000 miles on original oil filter with no changes. noisy but still running. diy , it's fun!

 

[LA_NC700X]

Got my bike for less that 2 weeks, just pass 500 miles on the way to work today...

Undecided if I should do the 600 miles oil change by myself as I always have with my other bikes... Dealer wants $180 for this 600 miles service...

Wondering what oil do you guys use? What oil filter? I have always use Shell Rotella (T6 5w-40) and Honda compatible type oil filter... Just a little worry about warranty issues in the future...

 

[drseth]

I changed my oil today with 514 miles on the odo. I also used Rotella T6 5W-40 Synthetic with a Fram filter from WallyWorld. $21.36 for 4 quart jug and $6.00 for the filter. I also adjusted and lubed the chain. Seems like my gas mileage is around 60-70mpg, which is not far from my 2003 Honda Ruckus 50cc with 38mph top speed. Pretty good mileage, I think. I may put the CalSci windshield in the upper position. I will need to trim the cutouts for the mirrors. The windshield in the lower position is too low to allow the airstream to pass over my helmet. The wind noise is bothersome. Other than that, the windshield is great. The Hepco and Becker Engine Crash Guard and the AluRack are supposed to be here tomorrow. I am excited about them.

 

[Beemerphile]

I changed my oil today with 514 miles on the odo. I also used Rotella T6 5W-40 Synthetic with a Fram filter from WallyWorld. $21.36 for 4 quart jug and $6.00 for the filter. I also adjusted and lubed the chain. Seems like my gas mileage is around 60-70mpg, which is not far from my 2003 Honda Ruckus 50cc with 38mph top speed. Pretty good mileage, I think. I may put the CalSci windshield in the upper position. I will need to trim the cutouts for the mirrors. The windshield in the lower position is too low to allow the airstream to pass over my helmet. The wind noise is bothersome. Other than that, the windshield is great. The Hepco and Becker Engine Crash Guard and the AluRack are supposed to be here tomorrow. I am excited about them.

Fram is just about the only filter that I would specifically recommend against. The internal construction of Fram is quite inferior to the vast majority of filters.

OIL FILTERS EXPOSED! - Fram

 

[michaelks]

Looks like something the kids made...if it weren't a sealed cartridge they could never sell something like that.
There isn't much left you can trust nowadays.

Lee, now i see why you said the filter I opened could be trusted...it really looks much better quality.

 

[LA_NC700X]

Decided to do this first 600 miles myself. I have done all the oil change in the past for all my other bikes, why not do this and save some $...

Just bought Honda Full synthetic 5w-30 (Red bottle) and Honda filter from the Honda dealership where I bought my bike close to work.

Question for you that have change your oil on NCX before... Do I have to remove the lower fairings/cowling for this oil change? Been hearing oil filter is a B to take out, I guess I will find out soon enough...

 

[treybrad]

I didn't remove the lower cowling -- plenty of room.

trey

 

[LA_NC700X]

I didn't remove the lower cowling -- plenty of room.

trey

Thanks Trey! I don't have to for most of bike... I always check that when I buy a new bike... When I bought NCX, I forgot to look... I was in love...

 

[michaelks]

I can confirm that, was next to the mechanic who changed the oil, no need to remove anything. Even though the owner's manual says you do.

 

[soggybottom]

I removed the cowling because of the clutch filter on the dct, I didn't know what to expect when the filter cover was removed, thinking oil might dribble down into the cowling but it didn't, so next time I won't remove it either. My engine filter was also properly tightened so no worry there anymore. If your filter is giving you trouble the 1st time I'd remove the cowling before damaging it with a wrench slip. Its not hard to R&R.

 

[mlh]

This is my first oil change. Can I usr full synthetic Honda MC oil in my NC, now or ever. Or should I use something else.
Thanks MLH

 

[turbodieseli4i6]

This is my first oil change. Can I usr full synthetic Honda MC oil in my NC, now or ever. Or should I use something else.
Thanks MLH

There are some that changed to full Syn at the first oil change. I'm at 2,800 miles and just put in Amsoil 10-30 MC oil in my NCX.