Craigmri
Member
I suspect if the pre-load can be adjusted to improve the sag setting for a 200 pound rider Bill has found an affordable upgrade for all of us. Cannot wait to hear how the preload adjustment goes!
Rear NC Shock Measurements please?
- Thread starter Just Plain Bill
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Just Plain Bill
Member
Take a look at VFR800/1200 and ST1300 shocks. I don't know their dimensions but they don't have cast on reservoirs (the VFR800 doesn't even have a reservoir) and that's a plus. Also, both models weigh at least what the NCX does so the spring rates might be similar. If the F4i shock doesn't work out, something like those might.
Craigmri
Member
I think the only problem with VFR shocks is they may not be as plenty-full since VFR guys may not upgrade like the super-sport guys do.
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Good show, guys! It's awesome to find out this kind of parts interchangeability stuff 
I'm keeping my fingers crossed that it's perfect for you Bill
I'm keeping my fingers crossed that it's perfect for you Bill
JamesD
Member
Not having a reservoir is not a plus unless there are clearance issues.
VFR800 owners are replacing their shocks with ones from other bikes because the VFR shock lacks adjustment.
As I said before, I bought a used Honda 929 shock for my VFR800.
Shock length doesn't matter so much as travel since you can add a spacer to a shorter shock though this may be easier with the VFR.
Just make sure there isn't too much travel or something is going to strike with bad results. It could be the tire to the fender or the linkage to the swingarm but either would be bad.
You can read the thread with the VFR info if you want ideas.
929/954 Shock Install (5th Gen) - Page 16 - Modifications - VFR Discussion - Page 16
JamesD
Member
A lot of VFR owners ride them as is but there are quite a few peg draggers that upgrade the suspension. Different shock, different fork springs/valves, RC51 forks...
The RC51 forks were more work that I wanted to deal with so I just went with gold valves/springs.
Just Plain Bill
Member
Update
The F4i shock makes a real improvement over the stock shock - at least for me. I weigh 193 pounds and ended up with 46mm of sag with the F4i spring at maximum pre-load. This was a significant improvement over the NC shock which, adjusted to max tension, gave 60mm of sag. My test ride was brief, consisting of a couple passes over some city installed rumble strips on the road leading into our housing development. Rear end was as nice as the front but it wasn't exactly a stress test of the shock fitment. I'll give it some time and miles in case parts are rubbing or the hose gets crunched on large bumps, etc. But so far, so good.
One problem I encountered: much like the system used in most conventional dual shocks, the F4i shock uses a housing with a series of five steps that the adjusting ring climbs as you use a spanner (or hammer & punch) to turn the ring, thereby increasing spring pre-load. Not sure if it was just my particular shock, but as I turned the adjusting ring, the ring and step housing turned together - preventing any kind of adjustment. I ended up removing the shock (several times) and holding the housing in a vise and turning the adjustment ring with a ViseGrip chain clamp. Then re-installing the shock.
One more thing. Before undertaking the in and out adjusting routine, I took the F4i shock apart in case I had re-assembled it incorrectly. But since it was apart without the spring it was easy to loosely install it and measure axle travel. I measured 4.875" (124mm) movement. That's a little more of a loss than I expected from the claimed travel of 5.9" and something off-road riders will want to consider before swapping out their shocks.
I'll take photos and post them tomorrow.
Bill
The F4i shock makes a real improvement over the stock shock - at least for me. I weigh 193 pounds and ended up with 46mm of sag with the F4i spring at maximum pre-load. This was a significant improvement over the NC shock which, adjusted to max tension, gave 60mm of sag. My test ride was brief, consisting of a couple passes over some city installed rumble strips on the road leading into our housing development. Rear end was as nice as the front but it wasn't exactly a stress test of the shock fitment. I'll give it some time and miles in case parts are rubbing or the hose gets crunched on large bumps, etc. But so far, so good.
One problem I encountered: much like the system used in most conventional dual shocks, the F4i shock uses a housing with a series of five steps that the adjusting ring climbs as you use a spanner (or hammer & punch) to turn the ring, thereby increasing spring pre-load. Not sure if it was just my particular shock, but as I turned the adjusting ring, the ring and step housing turned together - preventing any kind of adjustment. I ended up removing the shock (several times) and holding the housing in a vise and turning the adjustment ring with a ViseGrip chain clamp. Then re-installing the shock.
One more thing. Before undertaking the in and out adjusting routine, I took the F4i shock apart in case I had re-assembled it incorrectly. But since it was apart without the spring it was easy to loosely install it and measure axle travel. I measured 4.875" (124mm) movement. That's a little more of a loss than I expected from the claimed travel of 5.9" and something off-road riders will want to consider before swapping out their shocks.
I'll take photos and post them tomorrow.
Bill
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A hearty thanks for all your documentation and efforts sharing with the forum, Bill!
Just Plain Bill
Member
RIDE EVALUATION, PHOTOS OF F4i SHOCK IN PLACE
Took a 30 mile ride today up to Virginia City NV on the "bus route", which is sufficiently twisty for my purposes - those being to see how I liked the F4i shock in action and to give it time to rub, break or otherwise act out. Happily, it did not rub, break or do anything but keep the rubber on the road in a smooth and controlled manner.
As for "liking" it, I really did/do, except that it made me realize that the front end, which I thought was dialed in, isn't as smooth now as the back. Of course I still feel the bigger bumps in my hands and butt, but they're muted now, more like a leather mallet blow, not a hammer striking through the handlebars and seat. As I mentioned, the preload is set to maximum. The compression and rebound dampening are both set to the middle of their adjustments. There could be some more improvement to be found working on those adjustments.
Here are photos of the F4i shock as it sits in the NC700XD:
Took a 30 mile ride today up to Virginia City NV on the "bus route", which is sufficiently twisty for my purposes - those being to see how I liked the F4i shock in action and to give it time to rub, break or otherwise act out. Happily, it did not rub, break or do anything but keep the rubber on the road in a smooth and controlled manner.
As for "liking" it, I really did/do, except that it made me realize that the front end, which I thought was dialed in, isn't as smooth now as the back. Of course I still feel the bigger bumps in my hands and butt, but they're muted now, more like a leather mallet blow, not a hammer striking through the handlebars and seat. As I mentioned, the preload is set to maximum. The compression and rebound dampening are both set to the middle of their adjustments. There could be some more improvement to be found working on those adjustments.
Here are photos of the F4i shock as it sits in the NC700XD:
MZ5
Well-Known Member
Outstanding work, photos, and write-up, Bill! Thank you!
Just Plain Bill
Member
maxwellian
Site Supporter
Great work Bill!
I got tired of pouring over specs, decided to give the f4i shock a try as well. The potholes and asphalt anomalies of Los Angeles are really jolting my spine. Hopefully it does the job until I can afford an Ohlins.
I got tired of pouring over specs, decided to give the f4i shock a try as well. The potholes and asphalt anomalies of Los Angeles are really jolting my spine. Hopefully it does the job until I can afford an Ohlins.
maxwellian
Site Supporter
Got it installed and took a test ride tonight. I'm stoked! I could go into detail, but I'm finding the results are just what bill described. Very similar to the effect of the Intiminators up front.
Craigmri
Member
Bill, Max, thanks for sharing your experience with us. Bill, if you were to do it again would you do another F4i shock or try the VFR800 since you mentioned it has no remote reservoir.
Just Plain Bill
Member
Craig,
Now that I have a few miles on the F4i shock and see no evidence of the reservoir hose interfering with swing arm travel, I would definitely choose it over the VFR800 shock because of the greater adjustability of the F4i shock. BUT, if I ever find a (cheap) aftermarket spring with a greater than stock spring rate for the F4i, I'd probably grab it as insurance against hauling extra weight (or, ahem, gaining weight).
Now, that said, I am also interested in trying a 2007-10 Aprilia Tuono rear shock. It doesn't have a reservoir but does provide rebound dampening adjustment. The eye to eye length of the Tuono shock is 12.5 inches so you wouldn't give up any travel and spring diameter is 3.25 inches, so it will fit in the NCX frame. It will need spacers made (or washers) to center it in the Honda linkage. The shock is made by Sachs - a well regarded shock manufacturer. The Tuono is a naked RSV Mille race bike and comes from the factory with the suspension set up for racing, so even though it only weighs 435 pounds (wet) I'm sure it will handle the weight of a 500 pound street bike easily. Plus, Tuono's don't get the miles put on them that CBR600's do, so it's easy to find a Tuono shock with under 10K miles.
Now that I have a few miles on the F4i shock and see no evidence of the reservoir hose interfering with swing arm travel, I would definitely choose it over the VFR800 shock because of the greater adjustability of the F4i shock. BUT, if I ever find a (cheap) aftermarket spring with a greater than stock spring rate for the F4i, I'd probably grab it as insurance against hauling extra weight (or, ahem, gaining weight).
Now, that said, I am also interested in trying a 2007-10 Aprilia Tuono rear shock. It doesn't have a reservoir but does provide rebound dampening adjustment. The eye to eye length of the Tuono shock is 12.5 inches so you wouldn't give up any travel and spring diameter is 3.25 inches, so it will fit in the NCX frame. It will need spacers made (or washers) to center it in the Honda linkage. The shock is made by Sachs - a well regarded shock manufacturer. The Tuono is a naked RSV Mille race bike and comes from the factory with the suspension set up for racing, so even though it only weighs 435 pounds (wet) I'm sure it will handle the weight of a 500 pound street bike easily. Plus, Tuono's don't get the miles put on them that CBR600's do, so it's easy to find a Tuono shock with under 10K miles.
maxwellian
Site Supporter
Did a 40 mile round trip commute today, so much better on the washboard super-slabs. I don't have to hover off the saddle to keep my vision from blurring.
Regarding the vfr shock, I don't see that it has any features the nc shock doesn't. Doubt it would be an improvent. Extra reservoir space should be a big plus. I attached mine the same way bill did, but with a couple rubber shims to protect the frame paint.
Edit: Oh, I guess the vfr does have rebound adjust.
Regarding the vfr shock, I don't see that it has any features the nc shock doesn't. Doubt it would be an improvent. Extra reservoir space should be a big plus. I attached mine the same way bill did, but with a couple rubber shims to protect the frame paint.
Edit: Oh, I guess the vfr does have rebound adjust.
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Hyperborea
Member
Did you get around to trying a Tuono shock? Also, do you have any information on the width of the upper and lower mount of the Tuono shock? How much shimming is needed?
How about fitting in the Tuono RSV shock with the external reservoir? Is there room for this?
2004 2009 Aprilia RSV1000 Factory Ohlins Shock RSVR Factory or Tuono 06 10 | eBay
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maxwellian
Site Supporter
I'm pretty sure that any external reservoir would have to be hose mounted. It's really cramped in there.
Edit: Took another look. Perpendicular piggyback like that one might work, but it's iffy.
Edit: Took another look. Perpendicular piggyback like that one might work, but it's iffy.
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Garnet
New Member
Has anybody measured an S shock yet? I assume it's a bit shorter as it has an inch less travel.
Hyperborea
Member
Tuono Shock Measurments
2007-2010 Aprilia Tuono Shock Measurements (got the measurements from somebody else)
Lower bushing- 36mm width- bolt hole- 10mm
Upper Bushing- 23mm width- bolt hole- 10mm
Length 12-¼" eye to eye center - 311.15mm
Wet Bike Weight - 212kg
NC700X
Lower mount 39.1mm x M10
Upper mount 28.6mm x M10
Eye to eye 312mm
Wet Bike Weight - 214kg
That Tuono shock looks to be a pretty close fit. The shimming on the lower is 3.1mm and on the upper 5.6mm. So, put that at 1.55mm lower per side and 2.8mm upper per side. Aren't M10 washers supposed to be 2mm thick with some tolerance? You might be able to do it with them. Might have to get a large bag and look for the thin ones for the lower mount and the thick ones for the upper. How much play can you get away with?
2007-2010 Aprilia Tuono Shock Measurements (got the measurements from somebody else)
Lower bushing- 36mm width- bolt hole- 10mm
Upper Bushing- 23mm width- bolt hole- 10mm
Length 12-¼" eye to eye center - 311.15mm
Wet Bike Weight - 212kg
NC700X
Lower mount 39.1mm x M10
Upper mount 28.6mm x M10
Eye to eye 312mm
Wet Bike Weight - 214kg
That Tuono shock looks to be a pretty close fit. The shimming on the lower is 3.1mm and on the upper 5.6mm. So, put that at 1.55mm lower per side and 2.8mm upper per side. Aren't M10 washers supposed to be 2mm thick with some tolerance? You might be able to do it with them. Might have to get a large bag and look for the thin ones for the lower mount and the thick ones for the upper. How much play can you get away with?
