DCT Issue

[lootzyan]

Not much you can do. You may try to clean and reseat connectors to PCM, combination meter and sensors.
After that, you can't avoid visiting your dealer.

 

[HarveyM]

Digging back I found this thread, where the DCT fails to shift once warmed up :
Honda NC700X with shifting's problem.



The final post-

Hello! The mechanic told me that the shift power motor was broken in the electronic part. It is to be replaced.


I could have replaced it from me, spending a lot less

Inviato dal mio SM-G935F utilizzando Tapatalk

 

[Erik-in-Denver]

Update for my issue.

4) 25 Sept 18, 4th incident while driving home from work (70 degrees and Dry) went 15 miles and pulled over to do the DDNDN Calibration, which was susessful drove another 25 miles in stop and go traffic averaging 40 mph in drive with no issues. Got about a mile from home and decided to put into sport mode and make sure it wouldn’t slip or stick in a gear. Did some hard breaking and accelerating half a dozen to ten times before it occurred again. Limped home (2 blocks) and made this video.

Honda NC700X DCT Safe/Limp mode fix - YouTube

 

[670cc]

Update for my issue.

4) 25 Sept 18, 4th incident while driving home from work (70 degrees and Dry) went 15 miles and pulled over to do the DDNDN Calibration, which was susessful drove another 25 miles in stop and go traffic averaging 40 mph in drive with no issues. Got about a mile from home and decided to put into sport mode and make sure it wouldn’t slip or stick in a gear. Did some hard breaking and accelerating half a dozen to ten times before it occurred again. Limped home (2 blocks) and made this video.

Did you have any symptoms prior to your oil change and battery replacement mentioned in post #140? OEM type battery and recommended oil were installed? Honda DCT and engine oil filters installed? I’m not saying one of them is the cause, but the question obviously has to be asked so we can move on.

 

[Erik-in-Denver]

well the issue I was having which caused me to change the original battery (after 8k miles and almost 4 years) was, while driving the dash and lights would flicker like crazy, not enough to cause the engine to stall or be put into safe mode but enough to lose some acceleration power and smooth gear shifts because the computer was literally getting mixed signals. Checked the battery for Power, good. Tightened connection could have been loose but now good. Had the problem less often but none the less still occurred so changed the battery (OEM exact replacement) Figured it was time anyway. Haven’t had the problem since. A week later decided to change oil as it had not been changed since I bought bike with 1,600 miles on it now 8k+. Used manual recommended oil and filter. With no leaks.

 

[670cc]

well the issue I was having which caused me to change the original battery (after 8k miles and almost 4 years) was, while driving the dash and lights would flicker like crazy, not enough to cause the engine to stall or be put into safe mode but enough to lose some acceleration power and smooth gear shifts because the computer was literally getting mixed signals. Checked the battery for Power, good. Tightened connection could have been loose but now good. Had the problem less often but none the less still occurred so changed the battery (OEM exact replacement) Figured it was time anyway. Haven’t had the problem since. A week later decided to change oil as it had not been changed since I bought bike with 1,600 miles on it now 8k+. Used manual recommended oil and filter. With no leaks.

You said filter, not filters, so I have to ask: Was the DCT oil filter also changed a week ago, or is it still running the one that came on the bike when you got it? (Again, just asking questions to establish a base line to start with).

 

[telecam]

Thanks to Telecam and all who have contributed to this thread. I unfortunately have a similar issue with my 2015 NC700 DCT ABS and after reading this thread decided to join the forum (I would like to increase my membership level but cant figure out how to pay)

Quick Question, Was the Shifter Pin ever checked (sorry if I missed it in the thread)

Also my issue has happened 3 times now. (FYI I have no after market electronics of any kind on bike and battery is 2 weeks old, all fluids checked, no lights on display, and oil changed 1 week ago)

1) (23 Sep 18) The first after a 30-40 min ride (90 degree afternoon, dry weather) came to a stop light and when it turned green and I attempted to accelerate bike rev'ed up but didn't go anywhere, gear selector switch showed "-" with no other dash lights or faults. walked bike to parking lot and attempted to start normally but wouldn't due to gear selector showing 6th gear. After reading forums discovered I could hold brake and push start, then use up/down manual gear selector to lower the bike back into Neutral then put up kick stand and hit the transmission selector to Drive allowing me to continue the ride (15 minutes) back home, no issues. (this began my search for answers)

2) (25 Sep 18) the second occurrence on my way to work this morning (55 degree morning, dry weather), this time I was paying attention to gear selection display and as I decelerated (in drive mode) in traffic and the bike automatically shifter from 4th to third the gear selection display "-" and went into what I now know as safe mode. I accelerated slightly to see if the engine would rev as it did before it did NOT, and limped in the last selected gear forward. Then as I came to a stop in traffic (2 sec and 10 feet later) and signaled to move to the shoulder I attempted to accelerate again but this time went nowhere. Walked the bike to shoulder and completed actions to get out of safe mode (hold brake and push start, then use up/down manual gear selector to lower the bike back into Neutral then put up kick stand and hit the transmission selector to Drive) Allowing me to continue the ride 30 min to work (admittedly I was babying the bike in the right lane worried it would happen again in morning traffic at highway speeds)

3) (25 Sep 18) the third occurrence. After reading forum and discovering the D-D-N-D-N Calibration I thought I would give it a try and since I had to get the bike up to operating temperature figured I would drive the bike to get fuel and not baby it but instead try Drive, Sport, and Manual modes in a variety of situations (including hard and soft accelerating and braking in different gears) to see if I could recreate the issue. I did... 10-15 minutes into ride (after accelerating and breaking hard in a variety of gears and modes) I was making a right turn from a stop and while in Sport mode changed automatically from 2 up to 3 gear the bike went into safe mode with "-" on the gear selection display. This time I maintained the ability to limp back to my office in the last gear (I never slowed down below 18 MPH) once stopped I could hear the bike change gear (presumably to neutral as the gear selection display shows "-") and the bike would rev as in neutral. I completed the steps as stated above to get the bike out of safe mode and attempted to do the D-D-N-D-N Calibration which I couldn't get to work because I do not see the MIL, engine light show and therefore cannot hold down the D button until it disappears. (maybe doing it wrong, I will try again after work)

Cheers, Erik

Hello Erik,

All this is very familiar to my issue which was the source of that thread. My bike is still at the shop on its forth repair attempt and 75 days in waiting.... Obviously, this is one new isolated case of a DCT issue without a clear pattern and/or error codes and I am afraid that unless your local Honda dealer is much better than mine at trouble shooting this, you may be up for a long run. A few questions for you...

- Not that this matters but how manu miles do you have on it?
- In point 3), you say you don't see the MIL light. That's weird because that light always comes up (orange light with engine icon) when turning the ignition on and goes off after a few sec
- Did you manage to get the DCT to operate normally at the end of point 3)? In your description, it looks like you were unable to initiate a DCT reset (DDNDN).

Keep us updated, that is another interested case. Maybe hard to troubleshoot without getting a dealer involved though.

 

[telecam]

Update for my issue.

4) 25 Sept 18, 4th incident while driving home from work (70 degrees and Dry) went 15 miles and pulled over to do the DDNDN Calibration, which was susessful drove another 25 miles in stop and go traffic averaging 40 mph in drive with no issues. Got about a mile from home and decided to put into sport mode and make sure it wouldn’t slip or stick in a gear. Did some hard breaking and accelerating half a dozen to ten times before it occurred again. Limped home (2 blocks) and made this video.

Honda NC700X DCT Safe/Limp mode fix - YouTube

Yep, that's pretty much what my bike does once the DCT fails. But I see at the end of your video after you turn the ignition off and back on again, the gear shifting works again, at least to 1st gear. Is the bike working normally again?

 

[Erik-in-Denver]

I apologize if I wasn’t clear. I changed the engine oil and engine oil filter. I did not (nor did I say), change the transmission (DCT) fluid nor the transmission (DCT) filter. I’m assuming you will say that could certainly be the cause.... noted.... although maybe I’m just surprised a transmission of any kind would need even minor service such as an transmission oil and filter change after 8k miles.

 

[telecam]

Engine and DCT share the same oil, they each have their own filter though.

 

[670cc]

I apologize if I wasn’t clear. I changed the engine oil and engine oil filter. I did not (nor did I say), change the transmission (DCT) fluid nor the transmission (DCT) filter. I’m assuming you will say that could certainly be the cause.... noted.... although maybe I’m just surprised a transmission of any kind would need even minor service such as an transmission oil and filter change after 8k miles.

No, I wouldn’t say the DCT filter is the cause. The DCT filter change may not be due until 16K anyway; I’m not sure since I don’t have one. The DCT filter cleans the same engine oil, but for some reason Honda saw it necessary to have a second filter. There is no separate transmission fluid. The transmission and clutch oil is the engine oil. So, if you changed the engine oil, you’ve changed the transmission oil. That’s why it was important to ask. Like I said, I’m just asking the question so we’re all on the same page; not making any judgement call.

 

[Erik-in-Denver]

And telecam to answer your questions, I have a little over 8k moles on the bike. I was doing the DDNDN calibration wrong which is why I didn’t notice the MIL light. if you look at my post further down the thread - #4) I did get the calibration to work (no L fault) and yes the “fix” to get the bike started after it goes into safe/limp mode (key off then on, Brake and start simultaneously, down shift button mash till N light, then kick stand and place in drive) returns the bike to normal operation but only until the next incident of DCT slip/stick in gear and goes into safe mode.

 

[telecam]

You said "(key off then on, Brake and start simultaneously, down shift button mash till N light, then kick stand and place in drive), Can you clarify each step taken here. I am a bit confused by the wording.

Thanks.

 

[Erik-in-Denver]

Greg, I apologize. I’m unfamiliar with this bike and with posting but when you say “DCT” (dual clutch transmission) it made me think transmission fluid and transmission filter. Cause it’s in the name. But good to know the engine and transmission run off the same oil. And other than the normal looking can oil filter at the lower right side of the bike what other filter are you speaking of? The little flat pan filter in the oil pan reservoir ?

 

[670cc]

Greg, I apologize. I’m unfamiliar with this bike and with posting but when you say “DCT” (dual clutch transmission) it made me think transmission fluid and transmission filter. Cause it’s in the name. But good to know the engine and transmission run off the same oil. And other than the normal looking can oil filter at the lower right side of the bike what other filter are you speaking of? The little flat pan filter in the oil pan reservoir ?

The DCT clutch oil filter resides under the hexagon shaped cover on the lower right side of the engine. Hopefully you got an owners manual with the bike and it’s detailed there.

 

[Erik-in-Denver]

Telecam,

I’ll try to explain better along with the video. I apologize ahead of time if I over simplify or sound condisending, it’s certainly not my intention.

In the video you will see the display in safe/limp mode with the last transmission mode selected (in this case S) and the gear display showing “-“.

I start by hitting the throttle and although you can’t see it or might not notice the bike does go forward.

I then demonstrate that neither the mode selection switch (right hand side) nor the gear paddle shifters (left hand side) have any function. I turn the bike off with the key then back on with the key.

Once the bike is on you can hear the oil pump (I think) start and the clicking beneath the seat (not sure what this is but mentioned many times in multiple threads)

I then hold the hand brake and push the start button simulatioisly (I believe the brake interrupts the gear selection signal which would normally prevent the bike from starting in gear)

Once the bike is started I show me pressing the down paddle shifter (left side) until the transmission manually shifts down through the gears and back into Neutral (you will not see the gears on the gear display because it still reads “-“

once the green N light comes on the display you can put the kick stand up (won’t work if down) and use the mode selector switch (right side) to put the bike in drive or whatever mode you like.

I hope this helps

Honda NC700X DCT Safe/Limp mode fix - YouTube

 

[Erik-in-Denver]

The DCT clutch oil filter resides under the hexagon shaped cover on the lower right side of the engine. Hopefully you got an owners manual with the bike and it’s detailed there.

Oh, thanks Greg! Learn something new everyday

 

[telecam]

I don’t think the fix works on my bike. My bike is in the same failed state with the blinking dash. I can start the engine by holding the break but none of the up or down buttons are operational. It’s good that you can get back to riding quickly

 

[Erik-in-Denver]

I don’t think the fix works on my bike. My bike is in the same failed state with the blinking dash. I can start the engine by holding the break but none of the up or down buttons are operational. It’s good that you can get back to riding quickly

Sorry Telecam, I was hoping maybe you could toggle it back into neutral like I did. Bummer.

 

[dduelin]

I don’t think the fix works on my bike. My bike is in the same failed state with the blinking dash. I can start the engine by holding the break but none of the up or down buttons are operational. It’s good that you can get back to riding quickly

The other day I was trying to replicate the errors. I could flip off the kill switch, leaving the ignition switch ON, while riding in 5th or 6th gear and coast to a stop. The gearbox would usually downshift 1 gear before loss of oil pressure then coast to a stop in that gear. Say for instance it rolled to a stop in 5th. I turn the kill switch back on and would get the rhythmic clicking in 5th as it attempted to shift gears back to N. I would roll the bike backwards slightly to help it shift gears back to N. However, once in N it would not go into D or S and IIRC it would give the blinking "-". I found that I had to turn the ignition OFF then restart it to get bike to go into D mode from N.

Try turning the ignition OFF if stops in gear and see if a restart allows shifting into D and regaining motion.

The fact that I could get the bike to stop in gear and not then restart nor choose D leads me to believe there is some fault in the system that supplies 12v to the shift motor. Once it faults a restoration of power to the shift motor would not allow shifting out of N due to a safe mode. Where that electrical fault is or how to fix it I can't be specific.