Motorcycles with rotary engines?

[Saxeus]

I'm still fascinated by rotary engines and I was wondering if anyone had ever tried to use them in motorcycles. Rotaries are supposed to be lighter, smaller, narrower, more thermally efficient, and fewer moving parts than their conventional piston equivalents. The only major weakness is the wearing out of the apex seals but apparently this problem has been solved by an American manufacturer making rotaries for the aeronautics industry. Anyone heard anything recently about the possibilities of a rotary bike?

 

[Old Can Ride]

I'm still fascinated by rotary engines and I was wondering if anyone had ever tried to use them in motorcycles. Rotaries are supposed to be lighter, smaller, narrower, more thermally efficient, and fewer moving parts than their conventional piston equivalents. The only major weakness is the wearing out of the apex seals but apparently this problem has been solved by an American manufacturer making rotaries for the aeronautics industry. Anyone heard anything recently about the possibilities of a rotary bike?

Suzuki RE-5

[video=youtube;ammve9wcIzQ]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ammve9wcIzQ#t=16[/video]

 

[DirtFlier]

I believe Hercules, a German maker, had a rotary bike first then came the Suzuki RE-5, both in 1974. Much later, Norton built a rotary in 1987-88 as the company tried to recreate itself and a version of that bike was sold to the police in UK. In 1992 a full-race version of the Norton won the Isle of Man Senior TT which is still considered quite an accomplishment.

In regards to solving the riddle of premature wear on seals, it was probably Mazda that did it first since at the time all their cars were powered by rotary engines. And I honestly don't know if their fix started with the aeronautic industry. The fix saved the company at the time.

 

[Deleted member 1183]

The Van Veen Kriedler was one of the first. See ....

Van Veen (motorcycle) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I actually saw one in the flesh in Saint Tropez in the south of France in the 70's . A handsome motorcycle and seriously expensive. While I was admiring it on that very hot day on the footpath outside a restaurant, an equally handsome (and well heeled) couple came out of the restaurant with absolutely no motorcycle gear at all and prepared to get on the bike. The lady had on extremely brief shorts. She put her hand on her portion of the saddle and decided that her *** would be fried if she sat on it. She promptly walked into a newsagents closeby. She purchased a copy of Cosmo and then placed it between her lovely butt and the saddle. Then off they went. Gorgeous sound !

Not sure about the first bike to use this engine but have a look at .....

The Vintagent: A SHORT HISTORY OF WANKEL MOTORCYCLES

 

[Saxeus]

Thanks for the brief history lessons. And what a coincidence - as a young boy I remember having a poster of a Norton F1 up on my wall. I just liked the look of it but had no idea it was a rotary bike (not that I would have understood what that meant back then).

So the development of rotary bikes seems to have petered out in the 90's? Ah well, It seems electric bikes are the "next big thing" anyway.

 

[DirtFlier]

Thanks for the lead to Vintagent. It contained a lot of interesting facts.

 

[buckshot]

As the owner of an RX-8, I would LOVE to see somebody bring to market a rotary bike (c'mon Yamaha...), but I doubt that will happen with the engine in its current state of development and with emissions laws getting tighter and tighter. They've never hat great fuel economy, but personally I could really care less about that on a bike. Emissions though are tough, and the extremely high EGT that a rotary can put out beats the crap out of a typical catalytic converter. 1600*F is fairly common, and that's a range that gets diesel guys nervous. With the RX-8 and it's unique exhaust port design there have been quite a few cases of failed cats (disintegrated/clogged) causing excessive back pressure leading to engine failure. Given that cats are becoming more and more common on modern bikes, this strikes me as a pretty big hurdle to overcome.

Though Mazda has had the most success with the rotary, they weren't the only company playing with them. GM almost put one in the Vega, and did a mid-engine Corvette concept with a four rotor engine. If you feel like looking it up, GM was actually incredibly close to putting their rotary into production. Rolls-Royce also built a rotary, a little different from the rest though. One rotor did the sucking and squeezing, and fed that too a second that did the banging and blowing. Mazdas formula still isn't perfect though, and the RENESIS in the RX-8s still has it's share of reliability concerns. Carbon buildup is an issue, and the cooling is only just adequate. My fingers are crossed they'll bring the engine back sometime soon.

 

[Russell733]

I remember the old Arctic Cat snowmobiles with rotary engines, my Uncle had a couple of them back in the late seventies I think it was. They sure did sound different then all the other 2 stroke sleds of the time.

 

[StratTuner]

lets give Engineer Wankel his due...
Wankel engine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Saxeus]

My fingers are crossed they'll bring the engine back sometime soon.

Yep, last I heard Mazda had not shelved their rotaries and were still developing the RX-9, which was supposedly going back to what the RX-7 was - a proper two-seater rwd sports car. The engine itself I think they were calling a "16X" or something and had solved or mitigated many of the problems of the 13B.

 

[buckshot]

I'll be looking for a rotary concept car around 2017, and maybe a production model around 2020. You're right about the new test engine being called the 16X, though weather or not that's what they'll hit the market with is anybody's guess. Direct injection and laser ignition should make a substantial difference though, capacity increase aside. I hope they keep the four-door layout of the RX-8 though, keeps insurance premiums down lol