CBR600 Shock

[Antarius]

Also, I see what you mean about the valving being unrelated to spring rate. So it should be related to travel to stroke ratio. A very short stroke shock would move slower and have more resistance, right? Or a shock with the same stroke meant for longer travel.

Unless it was poorly (or cheaply) designed, yes. In theory you would need more compression damping for less travel than a bike with more travel to prevent bottoming.

Of course, you may have tons of travel and still prefer a stuff shock for your used and run a lot of compression.

Anyhow, in a properly designed shock with good valving, the spring rate should only affect preload.

 

[oyashirochama]

I found it interesting the sag is lower on the CBR600 spring than the stock even though the cbr is 150 pounds less than the NC.

 

[maxwellian]

I found it interesting the sag is lower on the CBR600 spring than the stock even though the cbr is 150 pounds less than the NC.

Yes, but again there is more to spring rate than bike weight, there is a swingarm and linkage that changes the leverage.

 

[Ruggybuggy]

Wait, but wouldn't that still give you a weak spring? You need to calculate the spring rate for our bike, and get one in the tuono dimensions.

I think the spring is softer not just because of a difference in weight, but a difference in linkage ratio.

You got it, difference in swing arm ratio. Find the spring rate for the NC and find a spring with the same length of the Tuono shock and it should work. Help!

 

[Ruggybuggy]

what do you weigh? I see the tuono is 408 pounds. did you adjust the preload? I was really hoping this would be a simple bolt on. have you ridden the bike with the new shock?

I weight about 180 in gear. The preload was sitting about half way on the shock and the amount of sag I had there is no way of adjusting it out. The suspension linkage ratio on the NC is different than the Tuono. A new spring will be required/

 

[Ruggybuggy]

Another thing I notice was when removing the NC shock the width of the upper and lower bushing is not that critical. The NC shock does not fit tight into the bike so adding washers to the Tuono shock with a result in being slightly wider could be a good thing.

 

[Antarius]

Okay, I will update this with my findings now that I've installed my 2007 Aprilia Tuono shock. Here's some observations:

1) The shock bolted in with no spacers needed or any problems. It took 45 minutes start to finish, including setting sag. I did not remove the entire "right side" plastics.

2) The bottom eyelet fits snugly in the Honda linkage and as such, prevents any rotation from the top eyelet, hence why washers or spacers are not needed.

3) The stock Aprilia spring is a little soft. I was able to set the sag properly, but I ended up using nearly all of my preload adjustment on the shock. I am 185lbs in gear and have a top box on the bike.

4) The shock has a single adjustment setting for "rebound." This is actually a combined compression and rebound adjustment, contrary to what other articles may read. It has 42 clicks of adjustment from "hard" to "soft". (Hard meaning stiffer compression and faster rebound, soft the opposite).

SUMMARY:
I wish I had done this 8500 miles ago. It's an unbelievably good uPgrade for the $70 I spent. I ended up with the shock set to 28 clicks from soft and what I'm left with is a good handling shock, which doesn't wallow, and removes any of the sharpness the stock "shock" experienced, whether going over large or small bumps.

Could it be better? Sure, a shock with independent compression and rebound settings would be great, but will cost more and not be quite as easy to install - though still easy.

WHAT WOULD I CHANGE?

I will add a stiffer spring when I service the shock in a few thousand miles. It's fine where it's at now, but since it's so far in the preload setting, it is causing the compression valuing to take some of that load. It's all fine for the street, but it's not ideal, and with a stiffer spring I can run less preload and have more of my compression stroke to do what it's designed for - compression damping. What does that mean? It means I can "soften" the ride even more, and still have a stable and non-wallowing bike. Right now if I backed the setting all the way to "soft" it would have too much sag and squat too much.

It should be noted ride height and sag as of now are identical to my stock shock. I run 30mm of sag, by the way....

BIGGEST DOWNSIDE?

You will immediately realize how crappy your forks are! Haha!

In short? Go get one!

 

[dduelin]

Okay, I will update this with my findings now that I've installed my 2007 Aprilia Tuono shock. Here's some observations:

1) The shock bolted in with no spacers needed or any problems. It took 45 minutes start to finish, including setting sag. I did not remove the entire "right side" plastics.

2) The bottom eyelet fits snugly in the Honda linkage and as such, prevents any rotation from the top eyelet, hence why washers or spacers are not needed.

3) The stock Aprilia spring is a little soft. I was able to set the sag properly, but I ended up using nearly all of my preload adjustment on the shock. I am 185lbs in gear and have a top box on the bike.

4) The shock has a single adjustment setting for "rebound." This is actually a combined compression and rebound adjustment, contrary to what other articles may read. It has 42 clicks of adjustment from "hard" to "soft". (Hard meaning stiffer compression and faster rebound, soft the opposite).

SUMMARY:
I wish I had done this 8500 miles ago. It's an unbelievably good uPgrade for the $70 I spent. I ended up with the shock set to 28 clicks from soft and what I'm left with is a good handling shock, which doesn't wallow, and removes any of the sharpness the stock "shock" experienced, whether going over large or small bumps.

Could it be better? Sure, a shock with independent compression and rebound settings would be great, but will cost more and not be quite as easy to install - though still easy.

WHAT WOULD I CHANGE?

I will add a stiffer spring when I service the shock in a few thousand miles. It's fine where it's at now, but since it's so far in the preload setting, it is causing the compression valuing to take some of that load. It's all fine for the street, but it's not ideal, and with a stiffer spring I can run less preload and have more of my compression stroke to do what it's designed for - compression damping. What does that mean? It means I can "soften" the ride even more, and still have a stable and non-wallowing bike. Right now if I backed the setting all the way to "soft" it would have too much sag and squat too much.

It should be noted ride height and sag as of now are identical to my stock shock. I run 30mm of sag, by the way....

BIGGEST DOWNSIDE?

You will immediately realize how crappy your forks are! Haha!

In short? Go get one!

What is the free sag and rider sag? Using excess preload to set rider sag suggests the spring is too soft, like you say, and free sag would confirm that.

 

[Antarius]

What is the free sag and rider sag? Using excess preload to set rider sag suggests the spring is too soft, like you say, and free sag would confirm that.

No need to confirm it, it is confirmed. It's no problem on the street, but a stiffer spring will make the shock even better.

Not something I'm going to swap out until I service the shock, the stock rebound and compression valving is good enough that it's not "springy" even with a ton of preload - but a proper spring will let me get back to a more neutral preload setting and let the valving work even better.

FYI, I run 30mm rider sag. Free sag is at 5mm which is at the lower end of acceptable. I usually go for 7-12mm on a street bike. So a stiffer spring would be good, but not necessary as it sits now. Hope I don't gain weight!

 

[Ruggybuggy]

What is the free sag and rider sag? Using excess preload to set rider sag suggests the spring is too soft, like you say, and free sag would confirm that.

I went to 89mm rider sag with the spring preload adjust set in the middle. I new as soon As I took the bike off the centre stand this spring wouldn't do. The bike dropped so low that it was considerably harder to get the bike back up on the centre stand.

If the proper spring can be found this would be a very good shock.

 

[Antarius]

I went to 89mm rider sag with the spring preload adjust set in the middle. I new as soon As I took the bike off the centre stand this spring wouldn't do. The bike dropped so low that it was considerably harder to get the bike back up on the centre stand.

If the proper spring can be found this would be a very good shock.

It's not hard at all to get a new spring. You can either figure out what the stock Honda spring rate is and go with that, or simply go with a Aprilia Tuono spring that is slighty heavier than stock. The Tuono spring is a 10kg spring. Personally I'll be putting a 10.7kg spring on it.

I'll be purchasing mine from race tech.

Also: Make sure your compression / rebound adjustment isn't all the way backed out. Mines set at just past half towards "hard" and that helps alleviate the spring issue as a temporary solution.

 

[dduelin]

No need to confirm it, it is confirmed. It's no problem on the street, but a stiffer spring will make the shock even better.

Not something I'm going to swap out until I service the shock, the stock rebound and compression valving is good enough that it's not "springy" even with a ton of preload - but a proper spring will let me get back to a more neutral preload setting and let the valving work even better.

FYI, I run 30mm rider sag. Free sag is at 5mm which is at the lower end of acceptable. I usually go for 7-12mm on a street bike. So a stiffer spring would be good, but not necessary as it sits now. Hope I don't gain weight!

5mm is at the limit I would think. As I see it using a spring with this little amount of free sag is going to risk topping out the shock when the bike unloads the suspension. A little more spring rate or a little less weight just as you say.

 

[wrecked'em]

thanks for all the useful info. my girlfriend I 155 pounds and doesn't ride hard. I think this will work fine for her. she has a bad back and im hoping this along with the ricor modded forks will be the way to go to take out the sharp hit the bike gives on sharp bumps. thanks again

 

[Antarius]

In case people want it, here's an Ohlins spring that will fit the Sachs shock. The stock spring rate is .95kg -- I am going to go with a 1.10kg spring, as I've used every bit of preload that I have (virtually) and still have too much rider sag.

AF1 Racing : Aprilia Parts and Accessories: Ohlins Rear Shock Spring -

The key is you want a 160mm or 170mm length spring (160 is stock), and a spring with an inner diameter of 57mm (or 57.5mm). If you are over 180lbs, or ride with more than 180lbs on the bike, you are going to want a spring rate higher than 0.95kg, probably something closer to 1.05 or 1.1kg.

 

[Ruggybuggy]

In case people want it, here's an Ohlins spring that will fit the Sachs shock. The stock spring rate is .95kg -- I am going to go with a 1.10kg spring, as I've used every bit of preload that I have (virtually) and still have too much rider sag.

AF1 Racing : Aprilia Parts and Accessories: Ohlins Rear Shock Spring -

The key is you want a 160mm or 170mm length spring (160 is stock), and a spring with an inner diameter of 57mm (or 57.5mm). If you are over 180lbs, or ride with more than 180lbs on the bike, you are going to want a spring rate higher than 0.95kg, probably something closer to 1.05 or 1.1kg.

So what is the stock spring rate for the NC? 1.10kg? Your about the same weight as me and I'm interested in how this is going to "sag" out.

Thanks for the link.

 

[JDE]

Thanks, for posting all your findings here. I've been watching this thread for a while trying to learn something and decide which route to go with for the rear shock. I've already got new R.T. springs a Gold Valves for the forks. Just watching to find the right rear shock application for me and my budget.

 

[Antarius]

So what is the stock spring rate for the NC? 1.10kg? Your about the same weight as me and I'm interested in how this is going to "sag" out.

Thanks for the link.

I don't know the stock rate for the NC, except that it was artificially stiff due to the lack of compression damping.

I spoke with my race teams suspension guy and he recommended I go with the 1.1 which is obviously stiffer than the Tuonos stock .95kg.

Racetech also recommends a similar weighted spring, for 185lbs.

I ended up grabbing the Ohlins above, but from my local guy, and will report back when I put it on. I expect to be able to get my 25mm of sag and still have lots of adjustment left.

 

[wrecked'em]

Thanks, for posting all your findings here. I've been watching this thread for a while trying to learn something and decide which route to go with for the rear shock. I've already got new R.T. springs a Gold Valves for the forks. Just watching to find the right rear shock application for me and my budget.

if you haven't already gotten the race tech stuff look into the ricors. I like the design and the install is easier.

 

[Antarius]

if you haven't already gotten the race tech stuff look into the ricors. I like the design and the install is easier.

Just a note on the Ricors, I did not have a good experience with them as far as performance, and had to dispute the charge to get my money back after returning them.

The install IS much more basic than with the RT's though.

Others have them and really like what they did to the forks. I just wasn't one of them.

 

[wrecked'em]

Just a note on the Ricors, I did not have a good experience with them as far as performance, and had to dispute the charge to get my money back after returning them.

The install IS much more basic than with the RT's though.

Others have them and really like what they did to the forks. I just wasn't one of them.

on what bike?