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Quieter windscreen...a work in progress

Flaferalcat

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This post is for people asking how/what I'm doing with the windscreens I obtained recently for making a possible quieter design.

I asked for a couple of OEM windscreens in the WTB section, and a few weeks or more ago I got 2 of them.
One, (not sure if the persons want me to name them, so I won't), was exactly the type of screen I wanted; scratched, stickys, and what not all over it. PERFECT!
I thought of making a type of wind tunnel out of a fan and streamers, but I don't see that working too well. SO....
I'm wanting and am trying to make a paper pattern, that I can use to make facsimile cardboard windscreens, (only a facsimile, as it will lack many of the compound curve qualities and only be 2D), so I can try different ideas until I get one I like.
I attempted using it to make a pattern. I then found out, as with many things that look easy enough, it wasn't. The screen has many compound curves to it making a trace difficult. With temps in the 90's F, and raining everyday, I taped 65lb cardstock the screen and set it outside. The humidity helped the cardstock form better to the curves, then I traced it out and cut it off the plastic windscreen.
That's as far as I've gotten for now. I need more cardboard, and with it raining everyday for a month now, and still in the 90'sF, I'm waiting on Mother Nature to help out a bit. I think for now, I may do a basic CAD drawing, or at least a full size basic drawing in Paint shop Pro that I can print out when I'd like.
My first idea though, is to cut shark-tooth like V's in the top to break up the airflow into different directions. I'll try and add pics later.
Eric:)
 
You were on the right track with the cardboard/humidity idea but you stopped short of the goal.
If you want a PERFECT "copy" of your windshield made from cardboard with all the compound curves accurately followed, set the windshield down flat on the ground and support the underside of it so it will not deform when weight is applied to the top.
Place your roughly precut cardboard on the windshield a SOAK it with water. Press the now soggy cardboard to the windshield to make it conform to the shape and let it FULLY DRY while on the windshield. You might lay some small weights on the cardboard to keep it firmly pressed against the windshield.
Presto, in a day or so, you've got the perfect cardboard copy of your windshield.
 
I achieved my goal for what I initially wanted, but I found I wanted something different that more efficient to produce. My thought's now are to keep it simple enough for trying several different methods of shaping surfaces with shapes to be more... audibly efficient. :D Than I'll try it on cutting the actual windscreen.
You're, of course, more than welcome to join in with your ideas, I'd like to see your technique. This could be a fun group project.
Thanks for the input!
Eric:)
 
I comprehend how you've shaped the fiber-based materials (whether cardstock, cardboard, or whatever) to compound curves. Great job! What I'm struggling with just a bit is: How do you implement this technique for screens of larger or different-than-existing shape?
 
I comprehend how you've shaped the fiber-based materials (whether cardstock, cardboard, or whatever) to compound curves. Great job! What I'm struggling with just a bit is: How do you implement this technique for screens of larger or different-than-existing shape?

I hope to use a similar method for my Victory Vision with a short screen that is much louder for me than the NC700X's is. If I can find a generic solution that that would work for both windscreens, that would be great. Possibly the shark tooth/turbulator theory? But as of now, until I can get a full size cardboard screen on the bike to ride around with, it's all just theory. Making the patterns out of cardstock though for the Honda involved taping 3 sheets together to get the coverage. If you just want a basic pattern, I would think just using more sheets of cardstock.
Is that what you were asking?
 
My intent was to ask how to form the cardstock to create a shape you don't already have. Isn't that part of how you'll be experimenting: To make shapes not presently available? Or are you experimenting solely with mild edge differences (the shark teeth, slight 'flips' to the edges, etc.) at this point?
 
Well this project is about experimenting with the windshield itself to make it quieter. Using cardstock to make a pattern is just the method I'M using for creating a series of cardboard windshields form boxes.
If you really want to know more about making compound curves with cardstock, paper, etc... There's the Card modeling forum or at least their used to be. A google search should help. Making models out of cardstock/paper is an international hobby. They can be bought and there are many free models available over the intenet using a variety of different methods to achieve compounds shapes. The hobby is not as popular as it was about 10 years or more ago, but it's still there. ;)
Sorry if I'm telling you things you already know.
 
OK! Enough delays.. :) In the midst of Health issues, Hospitals, insurance companies, my schedule, and Mother Nature... I found some time to plug away a bit more on this.
The initial version of the pattern, while turning out ok, wasn't vry practical due to how flimsy I constructed it, and not being able to lay flat, wouldn't be much use for laying on a sheet of stock lexan/persplex, plexi...yada-yada-yada...
View attachment 25669View attachment 25670

So, I made a 3 piece 2D pattern using a a free CAD program, (Metasequoia-LE, one of my favorites), and Pepakura designer, another free program which is a 3D unfolder. (That means it makes 2D Picasso style parts to be reconstructed into it' 3D form.) :D Only in this case I kept it 2D for practical resons of trcing it onto thick cardboard trial windscreens for testing. The 3 parts can be taped or glued together. I used UHU, because it was sitting in front of me already. The pattern isn't EXACT, of course, but it should be good enough for my purposes.
View attachment 25671View attachment 25672

I also saved the pattern to a PDF for easier printing by anyone., who wants to try their own experiments. IF anyone wants one here! View attachment 25673
The tight dashed lines line up with the bolt holes. I recommend taking your screen off,(you'll have to anyway), and laying it on your windscreen and pierce holes exactly where your bolt holes are so you can properly mark them on whatever your pattering . As this is only the 2nd day in a row, and only 4 days without rain in the over a month, I'm hoping to cut out and try out cardboard mock-up's shortly.
CYA NEXT! :)
 
Alright! Got in some more work into this project, and an initial test ride to try the concept, YAY! The cardboard holds up to...very hyper legal speeds. :D, so this should be good for all legal cruising speeds. One thing I noticed, was that straight away, the cardboard screen was quieter that the plastic screen.... Angle change? Material? Does the thicker rounded edges of the plastic screen disturb more airflow? Things for me to ponder....
Anyway, here's the pics/prodedure:

The plastic screen is sitting on the pattern to mark out the screw holes:
View attachment 25805

I laid the pattern onto a cardboard box and cut it out. **NOTE TO SELF&OTHERS** Try to find cardboard with a surface long enough so that the corrugations to be vertical! (This will allow the screen to bend more easily when mounting.)View attachment 25806

Cardboard cutout/w/curious cat. :)
View attachment 25807

Screen is mounted to the bike...no issues except it creased slightly because the corrugations, perhaps, were not vertical? It holds up well enough at highway speeds plus.
View attachment 25808View attachment 25809

Next up: Trying mods to the basic screen pattern for less noise. I'm going to trim mine down slightly though, as one of the issues I have is that even in the low position, the stock screen doesn't all much air into the lower helmet vents. Not a good thing for de-fogging performance, or cooling. I wonder if they can make a better defogging vent in the upper part of helmets? Hmm...
CYA NEXT!:)
 
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OK! So yesterday I made the first cardboard mod. I cut the top to make vertical turbulators, (shark teeth), for about the top centimeter or so.
View attachment 25940
It's really rough cut, I know.

The purpose of the design is to slow the air down as it coes directly over the top of the screen. In theory, it should cut down on the rushing noises up top, and the low popping noises Ican hear form underneath my helmet caused by the faster air pulling up the more still air directly behind the screen unevenly. The OEM isn't bad as it alows air in through the bottom so that there is some flow, but I still get what sounds like distant machine gun fire at freeway speeds or when the wind is blowing at certain angles.
I also packed the first carboard screen, and the OEM plastic one. I test rode them yesterday, and today and here's what I can report:

Yesterday- The sharktooth cardboard screen definately had slower air coming through/across the top than either the smooth carboard, and OEM screens. It was definately quiter than the smooth top, (1st cardboard screen). However, weather condiotions started deteriorating fast with storms moving in and unlike the test ride above, I found the OEM plastic screen quieter yesterday. The OEM also seemed about on par with the shartooth cardboard, but I had to head back to the shed before Mother Nature wonked my windscreen.

Today- The weather was drier, but there were more cross winds and such on the same routes as yesterday. I stopped at the same place, and rode the same routes at the same speedsas yesterday.
Result: I can't say the sharktooth is significantly quieter overall than the OEM screen, BUT...today the OEM had the machine-gun popping, and the toothed cardboard didn't. :) I'll call that a mild success.

It looks like I'll have to make a proper pattern to attach to a plastic screen and cut/file in the design to compare plastic to plastic, as the plastic screen has slight bend toward the rider in it's shape.
So, Who knows how to cut a design like that into plastic? I could use soe advice here, while I work up a proper cad design.
CYA NEXT! :)
 
The ONLY important airflow around a shield is that over the TOP, in reducing helmet noise. Getting the air OVER the helmet.

I have a 24" Parabellum that I bought not drilled and located it before drilling, so I see over the top about 3-4 car lengths in front of the bike.
(I ordered the 26" they carry but had the 24" drilled up before realizing they shipped the wrong size. But it worked out fine, anyway.)

Experimenting with other dimensions is pointless. Getting a shield as high as possible and still seeing OVER it, gives the best result, IMO.
 
Getting a shield as high as possible and still seeing OVER it, gives the best result, IMO.

I agree with you 100% Fred....
A helmet with a tight fitting neck roll and no ventilation holes is also quieter, I wear a Bell Star that I got on closeout because it vents the best of anything thus far I've worn.
However, none of that is the point of my thread. That type of windscreen would also, in the local Heat Index temps of 110'F and more, would mean I'd never use it from May till November.
Again, the point of this is to make a cheap relatively easy mod to the stock windscreen to quiet it down a bit, still give me ventilation and yet break just enough of the wind to allow comfortable riding.
FFC. :)
 
Getting a shield as high as possible and still seeing OVER it, gives the best result, IMO.

Not quite true. The width of the screen makes a difference too. The Integra has taller screen than the X or S but it's quite narrow at the top. Due to that I get return turbulence from it especially when the winds are not directly head on. This makes a lot of noise, even with the super quiet Schuberth C3. I have a Puig touring screen coming that is 90 mm lower than the original. One Integra rider from the UK who has the same height and inseam as me, said that his buffeting noises caused by the original tall but narrow screen are gone with this Puig model. So the width also counts.
 
OK! So yesterday I made the first cardboard mod. I cut the top to make vertical turbulators, (shark teeth), for about the top centimeter or so.
View attachment 25940
It's really rough cut, I know.

I find myself subconsciously covering my throat with my hand, looking at the shark tooth turbulators™©® though, lol

I would be too nervous thinking about those things pointed at me when riding, and coming to an abrupt stop one day. Maybe instead of cutting the serrations in the material of the shield, some glued on rubber or vinyl duplicates could be substituted?



ps- you would have to name your bike Bart. :D
 
Thanks for typing the suggetion!

I've thought the almost identical thing since starting this. I'm guessing that may be one reason no-one's done it? Playing semantics; they are flat at the tops. :D
One reason I wanted to go with cardboard, is that I also want to try alternating canvex/concave elipses (a gentler wave pattern, and other rectangualar serrations.

So, working with the glued on suggestion, I did come across some rubber gasket making material at ACE that might be able to be used fo rjust that. I would also be much easier to cut/work with,and the right epoxy should be able to hold it all together. I'd only have to cut the screen enough to make up for the add on.
FFC :)
 
Not quite true. The width of the screen makes a difference too. .....return turbulence from it

By return turbulence you'd be referring to a back flow of air getting to the helmet, with a wider base eliminating this back flow and noise.
Perhaps, but this air is still moving much slower than airflow hitting the helmet coming over the top. Flow over the top of a shield is moving faster after being 'redirected'.

I still contend the only air that REALLY matters is that flowing over the top of a shield tall enough to direct flow over the helmet.
Back flow air would be negative pressure air moving relatively slowly but 'dirty' and perhaps noisy if it gets to ones' helmet.
 
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