Question for DCT Owners

[pahondafan]

I'm sure this is a riding technique issue but being relatively new I thought someone out there could help. When I am in a turn at relatively low speed there is a point at which I am off the throttle. As I exit and I begin to roll on there is a lurch as the clutch engages as if I popped the clutch (if it was a manual). It only happens when I am transitioning from coasting to power. It does not happen from a stop or at high speed where the throttle is never fully released. It is not a regular downshift, I know what that feels like. It happens in both modes. Obviously I don't want a large jolt of power at that point in the turn. Am I the only one feeling this? My previous ride had a cvt so this was not an issue.

Thanks

 

[Jelly]

If it's around the 12mph area it's probably a down shift from 2nd to 1st, this is the only misgiving of a DCT IMO so far.

Some guys talk of using manual at those speeds.

 

[bduffey]

There is also a technique (not sure how long you've been riding) in which you stay on the throttle a bit and 'feather' your rear brake just a bit. This maintains higher RPM's for you in the turn. Makes it a lot smoother to start coming out of the turn. Takes a little practice, but it should eliminate that gear drop that you're feeling.

 

[BerndM]

I have noticed this "lurch" too when I decelerate approaching a red signal and then it turns green and I get on the gas again, in D mode.
Would using the Sport mode's wider RPM range eliminate this?

Regards
Bernd

 

[Jelly]

I have noticed this "lurch" too when I decelerate approaching a red signal and then it turns green and I get on the gas again, in D mode.
Would using the Sport mode's wider RPM range eliminate this?

Regards
Bernd

Yes, it does. Although I use the 'trail the rear brake' as mentioned by Bduffey.

 

[mike5100]

I'm fairly sure what you are describing is changing UP mid corner rather than down. It does this especially in D-mode if you are going round the corner with a part open throttle. If you go in with a closed throttle, then it will not change up. Also if you accelerate hard out of the corner it will hang on to the gear it was in too. The 750 engines have improved this aspect but it's still better to use S-mode if you want to avoid embarassment in a corner. If you are in D-mode it will do it (change up mid corner) but since you are probably tootling it's no big deal.
Mike

 

[Mi_ka]

Hmm - maybe some g sensor along cornering angle sensor etc could feed more data so it would not do upshifts in such situations but would the added complication and cost worth it?

 

[pismocycleguy]

I have noticed this "lurch" too when I decelerate approaching a red signal and then it turns green and I get on the gas again, in D mode.
Would using the Sport mode's wider RPM range eliminate this?
Regards
Bernd

This is also a common complaint in the DSG (dual shaft gearing) automobile transmissions. In my VW GTI-DSG tranny it can come into play. But I have found over the years to just be smooth in the application of the accelerator pedal. Both in applying and releasing. Probably will also work with a motorcycle.

 

[Old guys rule]

I'm sure this is a riding technique issue but being relatively new I thought someone out there could help. When I am in a turn at relatively low speed there is a point at which I am off the throttle. As I exit and I begin to roll on there is a lurch as the clutch engages as if I popped the clutch (if it was a manual). It only happens when I am transitioning from coasting to power. It does not happen from a stop or at high speed where the throttle is never fully released. It is not a regular downshift, I know what that feels like. It happens in both modes. Obviously I don't want a large jolt of power at that point in the turn. Am I the only one feeling this? My previous ride had a cvt so this was not an issue.

Thanks

I have come to downshift in anticipation of this lag a lot of the time .. No big deal for me, I like to know I can accelerate smoothly and quickly.

 

[ST13Fred]

I agree, it sounds like the DCT is up shifting at that point and not what one wants in mid turn.

Racers call this throttle position 'maintenance' throttle, where the rear tire is not braking OR accelerating, giving the tire the most traction possible.
Throttle is then gradually applied mid turn as the bike begins to straighten.

 

[mike5100]

I agree, it sounds like the DCT is up shifting at that point and not what one wants in mid turn.

Racers call this throttle position 'maintenance' throttle, where the rear tire is not braking OR accelerating, giving the tire the most traction possible.
Throttle is then gradually applied mid turn as the bike begins to straighten.

... And on the latest 750 DCT models Honda seems to have tweeked the programming so that it allows this - but only in S-mode. (If it really is a change to the DCT software, rather than altered engine characteristics, then the latest 700 DCT bikes may work better in corners too)
Mike

 

[scrumpymike]

"When I am in a turn at relatively low speed..."

What sort of speeds are we talking? Is it below the speed where the engine stops driving the rear wheel, and then as you twist the throttle the drive comes in again? As already mentioned, I'm always feathering the back brake at those sort of speeds - but another thought would be to check you have the right amount of free play on the throttle cable, as incorrect adjustment could make things a bit jerky.

 

[Brillot2000]

I agree, it sounds like the DCT is up shifting at that point and not what one wants in mid turn.

Using "S-Mode" will eliminate this. I always ride around town in "S-Mode". D-Mode is for intended for Highway riding with minimal curves and cornering...

 

[pahondafan]

"When I am in a turn at relatively low speed..."

Is it below the speed where the engine stops driving the rear wheel, and then as you twist the throttle the drive comes in again?

Yes, that's exactly the situation. The back roads here are covered with pea gravel so am am nervous about leaning into the corners too much so I am off throttle as I mentioned. It happens in sport mode also. The reason I am off the rear brake at this point is to avoid sliding the rear wheel on the slippery surface. I need maximum traction.

 

[pahondafan]

Thanks for all your replies. It is a beautiful day out today and I tried your suggestions. The gear is not downshifting as I am already in 1st gear but I tried all modes anyway.

Racers call this throttle position 'maintenance' throttle, where the rear tire is not braking OR accelerating, giving the tire the most traction possible.
Throttle is then gradually applied mid turn as the bike begins to straighten.

What works the best is slowing down even more before the turn and getting back on the throttle before I start turning so that any gear lash that happens is while I am still straight and upright. Then i keep the throttle steady until I am exiting. I think that is what Fred described. It works on all but the sharpest turns on these back country roads. I practiced the rear brake thing but that takes more coordination than I currently have.

Using "S-Mode" will eliminate this. I always ride around town in "S-Mode". D-Mode is for intended for Highway riding with minimal curves and cornering...

I like riding in "D" mode. There is much more tolerance of the throttle, I can coast without slowing down as much and I like the rumble that the engine makes as it works against the higher gear. Glad Honda gave us a choice.