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Eliminate the rev limiter?

If you don't short shift you are missing out on the best power production from this engine. This engine is designed to produce torque, not horsepower. The best wave of torque to surf is well below redline. Wringing it's neck for more power will only disappoint.
R
Try it - you'll like it.

The only time you have torque without horsepower is at zero RPM. Above zero RPM if you have torque then you have horsepower in direct proportion. They are not mutually exclusive entities.

No arguement with your technique, though. I almost always shift below 3000. Sometimes below 2500 RPM.
 
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All the 2V Ducatis are like this?
I had a week long travel experience 15 years ago on a Cagiva Elefant 750 and remember this granular-to-redline progression too even though I never hit the limiter, if it existed on that bike. I really want to know if all 2 Valvers are like this and how different are the 4 Valvers in comparison. Is the desmo (while great breathing at high rpm) any responsible for snatchy behavior under 3K or just the fueling?

That is my experience, which is exactly three different 2V bikes. I first experienced it on my beloved but oh so flawed MTS1000DS Multistrada. I seem to remember the redline was 9200 or 9500. It would just be wailing away in the most satisfying manner when - the very abrupt limiter would cut in - you thought the crank broke in half. A friend has a Cagiva Gran Canyon with a sweet 900, and I rode another 900 Monster (FI). All are wailing at high RPM. Folk who seriously track these 2V's run aftermarket CPUs and set the limiter up around 10500. Top end life is shortened which is why Ducati doesn't set them up that way.

My S4R was simply a ridiculous bike above 8000 rpm and I didn't go there much. With full throttle it would come up in 3rd above about 7000. And it was really loud at big throttle, even with earplugs it rung your ears. I just remember this savage power that really got you thinking, I don't think I ever hit the limiter. A couple times I let her go and saw 160 on the speedo - probably high 140's true. That's kind of scary with the wind ripping at your back. It was solid as a rock at any speed, and from 3000 to 6000 it pulled very nicely. I sometimes wished I'd kept it longer. I still go looking on CL to see what S4R and SR4S's are available...I got a kick out the S4R surging and clutch noises. It had a particularly musical clutch. Getting underway with clutch slips, surges, the deep booming engine with the celestial tinkling falling from above, it was a truly wonderful sound. Several times out in the world, as I put on my gear, I noticed a loitering crowd waiting for me to start it up.

I've no idea why the Ducati's are so dismal below 3,500 (3000 - 4000 depending). But, you adjust, in fact it's much easier than adjusting to the low limit on the NC700.
 
I think you just miss the point of this bike, increase / remove the rev limiter??? City commute. I think it does everything right for what it is! I miss the BMW k1200s and K1300s. 120kph in first gear excessive speed very fast and very smooth. Ducati monsters fabulous bikes in the twisty roads. All of these bikes ride differently. Monster for everyday city roads NOT FOR ME too hot and never out of second gear. NC700 for a fast run with the boys on the weekends NO way. Ride them for what they are.

Graeme
 
I got caught out today for the first time in 2 months (since getting the bike), with the rev limiter. I was over-taking a bus, with an oncoming car in front of me, when I hit the limiter. Luckily, I had just enough time to change up and get past the bus but a bit hairy...:eek:

What would be good is if the limiter was more gradual - cut power to 50% at the limit, 25% another 100 rpm further etc...not sure if that is technically feasible?
 
I got caught out today for the first time in 2 months (since getting the bike), with the rev limiter. I was over-taking a bus, with an oncoming car in front of me, when I hit the limiter. Luckily, I had just enough time to change up and get past the bus but a bit hairy...:eek:

What would be good is if the limiter was more gradual - cut power to 50% at the limit, 25% another 100 rpm further etc...not sure if that is technically feasible?

Totally doable. Most of my bikes (all my Hondas) have been this way, with a progressive limiter. I don't know why Honda bizarrely chose to make the thing so abrupt on the NC700. (the NC750's have changed this to a more normal "gradual" limiter, they claim)
 
There are a lot of interesting and informative responses in this post. My bottom line opinion is that Honda got this bike perfect for the intended purpose of the design. CW tested this bike at 115mph top speed at which it hit the rev limit. There are few bikes that posses the ability to actually pop the rev limit in top gear. Granted it will take you a long time to get there, but as an old Brit bike rider that is an "endearing" quality. Please tell me another full sized motorcycle that does 115mph if desired, but still can commute every day with perfect manners and get 75-80mpg (US). This engine is perfectly designed to do just that. As others have said because of numerous features such as 270° firing, long stroke, light weight components, valve springs, valve timing, single TB and on and on, this engine was never designed to squeeze more HP and revs out of it.
To add to an earlier response of Torque vs. Horsepower I will quote the Great Carroll Shelby, "Torque wins races, horsepower sells cars".
I actually hate the HP wars that are thrown at us. Horsepower was a made up specification to sell cars in the early 1900's so the average person had something to judge the power against that they were familiar with (horses). To calculate the un-measurable HP You measure Torque, X RPM then divide by 5,500. So you will have the same HP at 5,500 rpm as torque. If you can maintain that measurable torque to higher rpm's then you can achieve higher HP. It's the torque that continues to drive the engine to higher rpm.
My final (albeit somewhat egotistical) opinion is that those who want to chuck the rev limiter on this engine will soon be walking back down the road to pick up the shards of what's left of rods, pistons and crankcase bits. It was never built to achieve better performance.
Just ride it for what it is and enjoy the miniscule amount of money spent at the gas pumps.
 
I got caught out today for the first time in 2 months (since getting the bike), with the rev limiter. I was over-taking a bus, with an oncoming car in front of me, when I hit the limiter. Luckily, I had just enough time to change up and get past the bus but a bit hairy...:eek:

...

I've had that a couple of times, with alternating between the CBF600 and the NC750 I have to keep reminding myself which bike I'm riding. :confused:
 
I just now read this thread from end to end. There's an excessive amount of "what this bike is designed for" and "old Jim Watt's pony" and "I don't need to go fast" and "safe for the engine" and "when I took calculus in school" and such not in it. None of which is the point, the way I read the OP.

The brain dead cager out to kill you today has size, power, immunity to physical injury, all in his corner. These are massive advantages. He has no skin in the game. We do. We only have two little tricks in our corner: acceleration and nimbleness. And acceleration is the better part of nimbleness. Yes. You do need acceleration to drive safely.

You pull up behind a cell phoning dimwit with a bumper sticker that says: "I brake for no apparent reason", weaving about, paying no attention, looking for his coffee, tuning his radio, O Blivious. Cars are crowding up behind you. There's an empty space up ahead of him. You would be safer there. How do you get from here to that safe place? It's not about a race bike, it's not about going fast, it's about getting out of the way. On every other bike you downshift, you punch it, you pass, and then you can throttle back and relax. On your abruptly rev limited NCX, you downshift, punch it, and halfway round the poky bastid your darn engine cuts out. Cuts right out! How is that ever safe? No; not safe for the engine; but safe for you? Screw the engine. How is it ever safe for you when your engine cuts out mid-maneuver? Anyone who tries to say he never needs to get the heck out of the way, I hope he has good life insurance, God bless him. I have been riding 55 years. First thing I learned early on is, don't let them crowd you; go find the empty spot between traffic. A CHP came to drivers ed and lectured us on that.

That's why the original poster suggested removing the rev limiter. Least that's the way I read it. Not because he bought the NCX to go fast. Not because old Jim Watt hitched a pony. Not because of RPMs or torque or horsepower or ... anything else but this:

To get out of the way without his engine cutting out leaving him stranded.

So.

The ideal solution might be to buy that $149 "MAGNUM Programmable REV LIMITER" off Amazon and then be careful to stay below 6500 RPM.

That's the way I read it. But what do I know? I don't own one.

By analogy, I do own a KLR650, though. That bike suffers the opposite: It has virtually no brakes. You have to ride as though you can't stop. Cause you can't. The way we used to ride our Honda 305 Dream with drum brakes, shoes the size of your thumbnail. It's dang dangerous when you clamp down and you got nuttin. In the same exact way that it's dangerous trying to get past an idjut and the engine cuts out.

Let's address that. Has anyone eliminated the abrupt rev lomiter? Would it be better to wait for the 750 where that limiter has been removed?
 
I just now read this thread from end to end. There's an excessive amount of "what this bike is designed for" and "old Jim Watt's pony" and "I don't need to go fast" and "safe for the engine" and "when I took calculus in school" and such not in it. None of which is the point, the way I read the OP.

The brain dead cager out to kill you today has size, power, immunity to physical injury, all in his corner. These are massive advantages. He has no skin in the game. We do. We only have two little tricks in our corner: acceleration and nimbleness. And acceleration is the better part of nimbleness. Yes. You do need acceleration to drive safely.

You pull up behind a cell phoning dimwit with a bumper sticker that says: "I brake for no apparent reason", weaving about, paying no attention, looking for his coffee, tuning his radio, O Blivious. Cars are crowding up behind you. There's an empty space up ahead of him. You would be safer there. How do you get from here to that safe place? It's not about a race bike, it's not about going fast, it's about getting out of the way. On every other bike you downshift, you punch it, you pass, and then you can throttle back and relax. On your abruptly rev limited NCX, you downshift, punch it, and halfway round the poky bastid your darn engine cuts out. Cuts right out! How is that ever safe? No; not safe for the engine; but safe for you? Screw the engine. How is it ever safe for you when your engine cuts out mid-maneuver? Anyone who tries to say he never needs to get the heck out of the way, I hope he has good life insurance, God bless him. I have been riding 55 years. First thing I learned early on is, don't let them crowd you; go find the empty spot between traffic. A CHP came to drivers ed and lectured us on that.

That's why the original poster suggested removing the rev limiter. Least that's the way I read it. Not because he bought the NCX to go fast. Not because old Jim Watt hitched a pony. Not because of RPMs or torque or horsepower or ... anything else but this:

To get out of the way without his engine cutting out leaving him stranded.

So.

The ideal solution might be to buy that $149 "MAGNUM Programmable REV LIMITER" off Amazon and then be careful to stay below 6500 RPM.

That's the way I read it. But what do I know? I don't own one.

By analogy, I do own a KLR650, though. That bike suffers the opposite: It has virtually no brakes. You have to ride as though you can't stop. Cause you can't. The way we used to ride our Honda 305 Dream with drum brakes, shoes the size of your thumbnail. It's dang dangerous when you clamp down and you got nuttin. In the same exact way that it's dangerous trying to get past an idjut and the engine cuts out.

Let's address that. Has anyone eliminated the abrupt rev lomiter? Would it be better to wait for the 750 where that limiter has been removed?
Why does this continually get brought up by people that know nothing about passing on a NC700X?

If you know how to ride..... you downshift to the correct gear, pull out to pass, roll on, and shift to the next gear before the rev limiter "cuts right out" and still get all the acceleration 48 RW HP is capable of. Easy peasy, it's got 6 gears.....use them as required. Heck, Harley riders have been making do with less than 65 hp and 800+ lbs for decades. They run out of poke at less than 5500 rpm.

I could be as clueless about riding a KLR and ask "how is it safe to pass in traffic with just 36 KLR650 horsepower?

Of course a KLR650 safe to ride within it's limitations. A good rider knows them and it is a non-issue.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=em-upload_owner&v=ejem7e0bBF4&app=desktop
 
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There are plenty of technical articles on the 700/750 engine that explain how the mission brief of maximum economy from given displacement was achieved ........ I don't need to repeat any of that. This modern 650 twin is very different from others in the 650 class and that is why it has such a low redline. Honda builds engines to last and last and it's my opinion the low redline is to preserve this heritage of long trouble free life not to preserve chintzy materials.

Long, trouble free life is what drew me to the PC800 in the first place beyond the utility of the bikes design.
 
< Hasn't hit the rev limiter yet. It's a different mindset- upshift and twist, upshift and twist. just the same as the Buell, with 40 less hp.
 
Is it possible to eliminate the rev limiter on an NC700? I have been riding for nearly 50 years and I am fully aware of the implications of doing that, However, I like this new little bike and hate the limiter, not to mention that it can be dangerous in a tight traffic situation. Thanks for any help.


I dont understand why so many folks use this post to comment on the engine design. The poster says he has been riding 50 years so I figure he already knows torque vs horsepower. I too would like to kick the limiter to the curb, while still fully appreciating the design and tuning of the motor. So does anyone have a solution that doesnt require $500 out of my pocket?

T
 
When riding behind "O Blivious" the last place in the world I want to be is immediately in front of "O Blivious"....
 
The 750 engine can be tune with a power commander ref #DYPCV16-055. Unfortunately this product don't exist for 700 engine!
 
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