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braided break line question

WestcoastKid

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Hoping to get some insight from anyone with an NC who's replaced the stock front break line with a braided line. This would be mainly for improved (faster) emergency breaking. My local shop mechanic made the suggestion, but it would be good to know what issues and performance improvements to expect before making the change.
 
It’s a “brake” line, not break. Does your bike have ABS? That changes the routing of the line and number of lines involved.

If you have a manual model, one option for stronger braking is to install the three pot front caliper from the 2012-2013 ABS model. It gives you more mechanical advantage and potentially allows for a higher force to be applied to the front caliper than with a two pot caliper.

Magazine performance testing of the NC showed braking performance to be quite good. I’m not sure what your expectations might be for braking performance, Maybe the mechanic made the suggestion just to get a little more of your business (money).
 
Magazine performance testing of the NC showed braking performance to be quite good. I’m not sure what your expectations might be for braking performance, Maybe the mechanic made the suggestion just to get a little more of your business (money).
I've seen braided lines suggested on multiple motorcycle sites and YouTube channels as one of the Five Best Mods For Any Bike or something similar.

I'd like to get them on my VL800. That bike brakes like a wooden slug
 
Steel brake line isn't gonna help you as much as good brake pads. Stainless lines are cool, but in your particular application, seems like a waste of money to me. Unless you just want a cool looking brake line, of which I could totally understand. But don't think that it's gonna give you magical stopping power. Nothing wrong with the stock brake system with the exception of the pads themselves. The oem pads are ok, but there are aftermarket pads such as EBC HH sintered pads that significantly improve braking performance. I do track days on one of my NC's and have zero interest in swapping to stainless braided lines, because I know the performance improvement is so minimal. It would be different if I was riding a true sportbike with dual front brakes that was capable of seeing speeds of 150+ on track. But yeah, get some good brake pads and squeeze the lever if you need to stop, and it will do just that.
 
Steel brake line isn't gonna help you as much as good brake pads. Stainless lines are cool, but in your particular application, seems like a waste of money to me. Unless you just want a cool looking brake line, of which I could totally understand. But don't think that it's gonna give you magical stopping power. Nothing wrong with the stock brake system with the exception of the pads themselves. The oem pads are ok, but there are aftermarket pads such as EBC HH sintered pads that significantly improve braking performance. I do track days on one of my NC's and have zero interest in swapping to stainless braided lines, because I know the performance improvement is so minimal. It would be different if I was riding a true sportbike with dual front brakes that was capable of seeing speeds of 150+ on track. But yeah, get some good brake pads and squeeze the lever if you need to stop, and it will do just that.
The OEM stock pads are also HH sintered metal. While aftermarket pads might offer a different feel when applied in certain conditions it’s not likely that two sets of HH rated pads have significant differences in stopping power. The designation HH gives us that information. I would want to see objective data on stopping distances in dry and wet conditions before declaring any aftermarket pad provides significantly better braking performance in all around real world riding.

If a set of pads are glazed or contaminated in some way, just changing them for identical new pads would give dramatically different braking characteristics.

Braided steel lines would offer a different feel but in ultimate braking power they would not.
 
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Braided steel lines would offer a different feel but in ultimate braking power they would not.
It would be an interesting experiment:

Two identical bikes one with rubber and one with SS covered rubber hose.

Ride…….. back to back and correctly ID the SS at better than 50/50 chance rate.

Suspect the ordinary guy on the street would not be able to feel or tell the difference ??????
 
The OEM stock pads are also HH sintered metal. While aftermarket pads might offer a different feel when applied in certain conditions it’s not likely that two sets of HH rated pads have significant differences in stopping power. The designation HH gives us that information. I would want to see objective data on stopping distances in dry and wet conditions before declaring any aftermarket pad provides significantly better braking performance in all around real world riding.

If a set of pads are glazed or contaminated in some way, just changing them for identical new pads would give dramatically different braking characteristics.

Braided steel lines would offer a different feel but in ultimate braking power they would not.
I'm aware of the HH rating on both oem and the EBC pads I run, but how wide is spectrum of what falls into the HH rating? Maybe the EBC pads are in the upper end of the spectrum? I've swapped from oem pads to EBC HH sintered pads on at least 5 or 6 different bikes over the years and the difference is always extremely significant. At least 3 of those bikes were swapped to EBC pads with under 10k miles on the oem pads.

I understand what you are saying but just bc 2 companies make pads categorized as HH pads doesn't necessarily mean they perform identically. Just like buying shorts...I bought 2 pairs of shorts from Walmart the other day, 2 different brands, both size 36. Didn't try them on because 36 is what I wear. Couldn't even button one pair, other pair fit perfectly with plenty room.

I just know from my experience, EBC HH sintered pads perform better than any oem pad I've ran on any bike I've ever had. Also, there's the whole thing about "those darn EBC HH pads eating rotors up". If the pads weren't more aggressive in braking application, they wouldn't be wearing out rotors more quickly than oem pads, no?
 
I'm aware of the HH rating on both oem and the EBC pads I run, but how wide is spectrum of what falls into the HH rating? Maybe the EBC pads are in the upper end of the spectrum? I've swapped from oem pads to EBC HH sintered pads on at least 5 or 6 different bikes over the years and the difference is always extremely significant. At least 3 of those bikes were swapped to EBC pads with under 10k miles on the oem pads.

I understand what you are saying but just bc 2 companies make pads categorized as HH pads doesn't necessarily mean they perform identically. Just like buying shorts...I bought 2 pairs of shorts from Walmart the other day, 2 different brands, both size 36. Didn't try them on because 36 is what I wear. Couldn't even button one pair, other pair fit perfectly with plenty room.

I just know from my experience, EBC HH sintered pads perform better than any oem pad I've ran on any bike I've ever had. Also, there's the whole thing about "those darn EBC HH pads eating rotors up". If the pads weren't more aggressive in braking application, they wouldn't be wearing out rotors more quickly than oem pads, no?
Er, no, that is not accurate. 80 grit sandpaper pads would likely eat the rotors faster and probably have far less stopping power. The two factors of rotor wear and friction coefficient do not corelate.

I didn't say the two perform identically. I said they both meet the standards of cold and hot friction coefficients in standardized testing for HH pads. The HH standard rules out dramatic differences between pads so rated.
 
The OEM stock pads are also HH sintered metal.

I was just out doing some checks before we head out on vacation on the bike tomorrow, and noticed that the rear pads (I have the Honda parts department replacement pads on my bike) are EE rated, not HH. I can’t see the fronts because I (re)use the factory shims.

I wonder whether the fronts are also EE, or if they use a significantly different compound, front vs rear.

I don’t think I’d want much more bite at the rear of this bike. Seems like it’d be pretty easy to lock it up that way.

A0791F08-30EB-4084-9D15-EAA51A876E42.jpeg
 
I was just out doing some checks before we head out on vacation on the bike tomorrow, and noticed that the rear pads (I have the Honda parts department replacement pads on my bike) are EE rated, not HH. I can’t see the fronts because I (re)use the factory shims.

I wonder whether the fronts are also EE, or if they use a significantly different compound, front vs rear.

I don’t think I’d want much more bite at the rear of this bike. Seems like it’d be pretty easy to lock it up that way.

View attachment 45472
The OEM pads in front are HH and the rears, at least prior to 2016, are not HH. Past threads have discussed this difference particularly in light of the rear brake’s lack of effectiveness.
 
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I installed the Spiegler braided stainless steel brake line kit on my 2013 NC700X. I primarily did it because I wanted to replace the 7-year old hoses (there is a big debate about whether this is necessary or not; but the short version is I just wanted to do it).

I wasn't really expecting a big improvement in stopping performance, but I did notice a lot more linear brake feel after replacing the hoses, especially on the front. My best guess is that this has as much to do with fresh brake fluid and proper bleeding as it does from the material the hose is made of. But the stainless lines look cool, are a bit tougher, and should last the lifetime of the vehicle.

Braided steel lines would offer a different feel but in ultimate braking power they would not.
I will second this. Lots of things you can do to brake systems will help with the feel and linearity, but very few will help with ultimate brake power. Generally having good feedback and feel will serve you more than increased stopping power to prevent locking up a wheel and crashing.
 
I was just out doing some checks before we head out on vacation on the bike tomorrow, and noticed that the rear pads (I have the Honda parts department replacement pads on my bike) are EE rated, not HH. I can’t see the fronts because I (re)use the factory shims.

I wonder whether the fronts are also EE, or if they use a significantly different compound, front vs rear.

I don’t think I’d want much more bite at the rear of this bike. Seems like it’d be pretty easy to lock it up that way.

View attachment 45472
I dredged up an old thread here and found it relevant to the discussion on improving brake performance.
 
Thanks for the pic of the backing plate of the Honda front pads (in the other thread).

Now that you linked it, I remember that thread (in general, not in the specific details).
 
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