Fuel Bladders instead of MSR bottles?

[melensdad]

So I'm looking for a safe way to carry gas on a trip we are planning up into some rural areas in Canada. 2 bikes (NC700x + NC750x), looking to carry roughly 1 to 2 gallons of fuel total.

For the sake of discussion, all costs are "new" items. I realize savings may be found on used goods.

MSR Bottles: 4 bottle set up = $160 to carry 1 gallon of fuel

• MSR 1-liter bottles, roughly $25/bottle x 4 bottles = $100
• Harness, tube, etc to hold them on bike. Prices vary, but assume $15 each = $60 (some options are much more expensive, some less expensive, picked $15 as an "average" cost)
• Fuel capacity = 1 gallon.

If "Endurostan" brand bottle harnesses are used, then 1.5 liter bottles can be used, cost goes up to $120 for harnesses, total cost = $220, but capacity of 4 bottles = 2 gallons​

Clearly neither of those are inexpensive ways to carry 1 or 2 gallons of gas.

I also am not thrilled with the fact that these solutions take up permanent space on the motorcycles. I don't see the need to carry extra fuel every day. Mounting a couple TOOL TUBES to each bike just adds something else that needs to come off the bike if there is a maintenance issue. Not looking to keep those on the bike 24/7/365 days a year. Just not desired for my personal purposes, we each are different, I understand some choose to keep them 24/7, I simply choose not to do that at this time. I am actually more attracted to the fabric holsters/harnesses that came easily be taken off the bikes at the end of a trip. Prices of those range from $5 up to about $30. Those are a great choice if you don't want permanent fuel bottles but expose the bottles, which might not always be desirable. Still, for a trip they might be great.

Looking for other alternatives.

GIANT LOOP FUEL BLADDER, eBay has a 2 gallon bladder for $195

Still seems pretty darned expensive to carry 2 gallons of gas, but I like the fact it can rolled up and stowed away for the 95% of the time it will not be needed. Even on a trip into rural Canada the fuel back up will likely only be wanted (and hopefully never actually needed) for 5 days out of a 20 day trip.


In the Australia/New Zealand I see a brand called LIQUID CONTAINMENT that makes a 10 liter bladder. Can't find a North American source for that product. Not sure the cost to get one shipped to the US. Its a very basic bladder. Priced at $AD125 down there. 10 Litre Touring Bladder - Liquid Containment Bladders & Liners – Fuel, Water, Petrol, Diesel, Water Storage

Also down under is a brand called DESERT FOX that makes fuel bladders for motorcycles. They have a 6 liter size. Again, can't find a North American source and no clue what the cost is, but it might be in the same category as the Giant Loop based on its features. Desert Fox Fuel Cells, Jerry Cans and Fuel Bladders – Desert Fox Professional Riding Gear



Certainly there must be more options? Any advice, help on this? Again, looking for a SAFE way to carry, that is compact for TRAVEL, and still won't break the bank.

Thoughts?

 

[670cc]

I have no experience with the fuel bladders. You didn’t mention Rotopax containers, so I’ll mention them. I typically carry a 1 gallon Rotopax on trips. It’s mounted on the rack that’s substituted for my rear seat, and a dry bag goes on top of the Rotopax, so it’s not in the way at all. They mount on brackets for easy removal when not needed, but the bracket is still in the way even if the container is removed. There are locking options if you’re concerned about theft of the container. The advantage is you can carry larger amounts of fuel safely (one of mine is 1 3/4 gallon), but the disadvantage is they take up space and add weight whether you have fuel in them or not.

MSR bottles are nice for small emergency amounts, but at only 30 ounces a pop, they don’t go very far.

 

[melensdad]

I didn't mention Rotopax

Swapping out the rear seat for a rack is about $250 so you can fuel through the bracket. I like the rack idea a lot. But adding the rack dramatically raises the total cost to haul fuel because you still have to add the cost of the Rotopax bracket and the cost of the container.

Now I could mount a Rotopax bracket to one of my side boxes, but its still the cost of the bracket + the container. That is roughly $65 for a 1 gallon can + roughly $40 for a mount. $105 for 1 gallon of fuel. Or about $125 for 1.75 gallons of fuel with the next larger container.

It might be a reasonable choice given its size. The bracket itself could be left on the side case 24/7/365 and it is not particularly obtrusive. It would put the weight of 1 gallon of fuel low if mounted on a side case, but also would put all the fuel weight on 1 side of the bike. I'm going to have to take a bunch of measurements and see where I can fit a Rotopax. If I can fit one in the space between my side case bracket and the wheel it might be a really good option?

 

[670cc]

Googling images of Rotopax mounts on motorcycles shows many creative methods.

 

[melensdad]

Googling images of Rotopax mounts on motorcycles shows many creative methods.

The 1 gallon container is only 3" thick in depth. 1.75 gallon is 3.5" That opens up some mounting options that could work really well.

1 Gallon - 9.5"L x 13.5"W x 3"H
1.75 Gallon - 14"L x 15"W x 3.5"H​

Obviously there are a lot of people using Rotopax. It is less expensive than the other options but certainly not economical.


Amazon has some Chinese knock off containers that are much less expensive. Perhaps not expedition grade. But possibly a viable option if I can figure out a space to fit it that is not obtrusive. LINK => Amazon.com: YOUNGFLY Gas Can 1.3 Gallon Portable Fuel Oil Petrol Diesel Storage Gas Tank Emergency Backup for Motorcycle Car SUV ATV with Lock Oil Pack Fuel Cans Fuel(5L,Red): Automotive

Downside to the Chinese knock off is the blocky/chunky size of the container that might make mounting harder in an unobtrusive spot.

1.3 Gallon - 11.4" x 9.8" x 4.7"​

Does anyone have any experience with these? Under $35 for the container + mount for 1.3 gallons is a bargain IF IT WORKS

 

[ColoradoChris]

I had been contemplating one of the knockoffs. This conversation finally got me off the mark and I ordered one. It is scheduled to arrive mid Nov, so it will be a while before I know whether or not it will work. My plan is to mount it on the exposed frame tube above the passenger footpeg. Hopefully that will clear the Givi side cases and my legs..... I will report back with pictures and impressions once it arrives.

 

[melensdad]

I had been contemplating one of the knockoffs. This conversation finally got me off the mark and I ordered one. It is scheduled to arrive mid Nov, so it will be a while before I know whether or not it will work. My plan is to mount it on the exposed frame tube above the passenger footpeg. Hopefully that will clear the Givi side cases and my legs..... I will report back with pictures and impressions once it arrives.

THANK YOU

After going out to the garage and taking some measurements, I do not have enough room in between my side cases and the rear wheel to mount any of the above "roto" style cases in that wasted space. Looks like I'm going to need inspiration from your project to see if that is a workable solution for me but it sure sounds like it might be a good spot.

Another option (since I have rectangular side cases) might be to simply mount to the front side of the case.

 

[670cc]

On one of my bikes I have Pelican cases, which are pretty strong. I have a Rotopax mount on, in this case, the top box. I put an aluminum plate on the back side to spread out the load

 

[ColoradoChris]

One of my "ideas" is to find a trashed monokey bag and cut away all I don't need to have it clip on and mount a rotopax mount to it. That would let me mix and match bags and fuel mount locations as needed.

 

[HarveyM]

I had been contemplating one of the knockoffs. This conversation finally got me off the mark and I ordered one. It is scheduled to arrive mid Nov, so it will be a while before I know whether or not it will work. My plan is to mount it on the exposed frame tube above the passenger footpeg. Hopefully that will clear the Givi side cases and my legs..... I will report back with pictures and impressions once it arrives.

I played with this idea- with 1 gallon rotopax mounted using the passenger peg through the bottom handle & a mount on the frame tube. I wasn't happy with the outcome.
1) The frame tube where I wanted to attach the rotopax mount is covered by the plastic shroud covering the gas tank. There's no space to slip a clamp on one side of the mounting plate.
2) Even with my delicate size 8 1/2s I wasn't happy with my heel clearance. I worried about trapping my leg.

So I went back to a 1 liter MSR bottle on my recent trip. If I were really worried about needing extra fuel I'd follow 670's advice.

 

[melensdad]

I played with this idea- with 1 gallon rotopax mounted using the passenger peg through the bottom handle & a mount on the frame tube. I wasn't happy with the outcome.
...
If I were really worried about needing extra fuel I'd follow 670's advice.

The flat-rectangle shape of the Rotopax is not ideal for mounting in front of the side box onto the frame. Your photo clearly shows that. The more squarer-box shape of the Amazon knock off box, might fit there?

My thought would be to mount to the front face of my side box. But I have rectangular side boxes that would allow for that more easily than the contoured GIVI side cases.

I may build a cardboard box gas can to try different mounting spots on the bike to see what might actually work.

 

[ColoradoChris]

I went out and held up a gallon antifreeze jug (same thickness, slightly different height and width). It will depend a lot on how/where the mount has to sit to make everything line up. Pretty sure with my 21L side cases it won't interfere with my legs. The 35L ones may push it too far forward. If that's the case, I will probably mount it to the top or front or maybe even bottom of one of the 35l cases or at least that's the working theory.

In theory, theory and reality are the same, in reality they may not be....

 

[HarveyM]

I tried it because of the pegpacker & a guy on a dual-sport had good results with mounting his Rotopax on a footpeg. The dual-sport was using soft bags, so they weren't as wide as my Givis. I don't regret giving it a shot, but it's not a slam dunk.

 

[melensdad]

So my wife has GIVI V35 (34 liter capacity) cases on her NC700x and I have H & B Gobi 37 liter cases on mine.

The GIVI cases are rather stylish, aerodynamic.
The H & B Gobi cases look like silver colored Igloo coolers. Makes the NC750x look like a pizza delivery motorcycle. As aerodynamic as a brick.

That said, when looking at the pillion foot pegs, the GIVI V35 cases, because of their design, have the leading edge of the case almost directly over the rear foot pegs. With my H & B Gobi boxes, the leading edge is clearly rearward of the foot pegs.

I have both 1 gallon and also a 5 liter gas cans. I held them up on my bike, as if they were fastened to the front side of my Gobi side boxes. Both allowed plenty of clearance for my leg. Clearly other brand side boxes, or boxes of other capacities and dimensions should be measured for leg clearance. But in theory the 1 gallon Amazon knock off can should work for me if that is the route I choose to go. At this point it is the cheapest way to carry 1+ gallon of gas. Not convinced it is the best way, but it I don't think it is a bad way.

I still like the idea of a bladder that can be stowed in the bottom of a side case, or rolled away and stuffed somewhere for the 75% of the time that it is not needed. For the 25% of the trip where it might be handy, it could be filled and be strapped across the rear seat with the camping gear. I just don't like the OUTRAGEOUS cost of the bladders.

 

[HarveyM]

There's a South African company that sells a Desert Fox 1.3 gallon fuel bladder at $48 US (plus shipping). What reports I've read they work fine (including on the Trans Labrador).

Desert Fox Fuel Cell 5L | Flying Brick

 

[melensdad]

If it is $48 then I know what my wife is getting for Christmas

 

[ColoradoChris]

If it is $48 then I know what my wife is getting for Christmas

That's what the exchange rate came out to. I have an email into them to inquire about shipping cost......

 

[melensdad]

While we wait to find out about the Desert Fox I walked out to the garage and took some photos.

The green can is a 5 liter gas can just used to represent size.

On the NC750x, with 37 liter H&B Gobi boxes, the gas can fits nicely while sitting on the rear passenger foot pegs. It actually leans back slightly. There are approximately 5.25 inches of space behind the foot peg to the front of the cargo box. Sitting on the bike, there is plenty of room for the can. So I am pretty confident I could mount a box to the front of the cargo box if this is the route I choose to follow.

On the NC700x, with 34 liter Givi V35 boxes, the boxes extend farther forward on the bike and the leading edge of the boxes is only about 2.5" behind the passenger foot peg and is sloped downward. It took a bit of time but I managed to balance the 5 liter gas can on the foot peg. The shape of the Givi V35 box is not conducive to mounting the gas can on the forward side of the box. Mounting above the peg puts the front edge of the gas can a few inches forward of the foot peg. If a suitable mount could be found, this could still work as a mounting position but I'm not sure how it would be secured/braced if the can was oriented in this manner. The can looks awkward in this position.

 

[670cc]

I’m guessing you show the can on the right side because you can balance it there for illustration, but given a choice, I’d mount it on the left side to avoid the muffler heat. But, you probably already know that.

Not to sound negative, but just to state fact, the large side cases put quite a drain on fuel economy. All the more reason you’ll want some extra fuel along. When I put little 21 liter side bags on and do highway riding, I see up to 5 mpg loss.

 

[Rapturee]

670... that is correct. I too see a 8-10mpg hit with all three of my boxes on. A little less on the slower state highways and slightly more on the Interstates...Oouch!


I found these...
Giant Loop Gas Bag Fuel Safe Bladder | eBay

They have 1gl or 2gl available... :{)