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Thread: Brake balance, NC750 SA 2016

  1. #21
    Senior Member Brake balance, NC750 SA 2016 dduelin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by melensdad View Post
    The 2018 and 2019 brake looks nothing like that.
    Post #16 by 670cc, only 2012-2013 ABS bikes had linked brakes with the three piston front caliper. Linked brakes did not appear on 2014 and later bikes.
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  2. #22
    Senior Member Brake balance, NC750 SA 2016
    Brake balance, NC750 SA 2016
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    Pharfar - you stated a brake balance of "70/30" but I don't think you can apply such numbers to a motorcycle that has separate controls for front & rear brakes and perhaps linked system. The brake balance numbers are more for cars where one brake pedal operates front & rear brakes and there is a proportioning valve in the hydraulic system to maintain that balance.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by DirtFlier View Post
    Pharfar - you stated a brake balance of "70/30" but I don't think you can apply such numbers to a motorcycle that has separate controls for front & rear brakes and perhaps linked system. The brake balance numbers are more for cars where one brake pedal operates front & rear brakes and there is a proportioning valve in the hydraulic system to maintain that balance.
    I assumed he was talking about brake force in terms of how much of your total braking is represented individually by front and rear. The 70 / 30 rule is that 70% of your stopping power comes from your front brakes alone, 30% from rear. He mentioned the rear rotor being small, but first he must understand why it is small. It is because Most of your stopping power comes from the front, this is why front brake rotors are much larger than rear. It doesn't take much to lock up a rear tire regardless of how fast you're going, so a single small rotor on the rear is more than plenty for even the fastest or heaviest bikes. An oversized single front rotor is sufficient for stopping power on the NC, but on higher performance bikes, you need dual front rotors to have sufficient stopping power in high speed applications or on heavy touring/cruiser bikes - my Vulcan Nomad 1600 bagger has dual front brakes.

    Proper braking technique, abs or not, is to always use both front and rear brakes together and never apply more rear brakes than front. It's safer to just not use rear brakes at all than to overapply them.

  4. #24
    Senior Member melensdad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dduelin View Post
    Post #16 by 670cc, only 2012-2013 ABS bikes had linked brakes with the three piston front caliper. Linked brakes did not appear on 2014 and later bikes.
    Did a bit of digging on the Honda website. Went into their archives.

    Honda is saying they are using linked brakes.

    Quote Originally Posted by HONDA
    DISC BRAKES WITH AVAILABLE COMBINED ABS

    Single front and rear disc brakes give the NC750X great stopping power. The DCT model comes with ABS brakes that are linked rear-to-front for added stopping power, even under challenging conditions.

    Honda is claiming linked brakes on the 2016 through 2019 model year NC700x and NC750x bikes, but only the models with DCT.

    As the NC700/750 model was updated in 2016 and is basically the same from 2016 forward I went back and checked the Honda pages. I presume (but do not know if) the pages are correct.

    Link to Honda's page that references 2019 linked brakes => 2019 NC750X FEATURES - Honda
    The exact same quote in also on the 2018 page => 2018 NC750X FEATURES - Honda
    Again, same wording for the model year 2017 page => 2017 NC700X FEATURES - Honda
    Ditto, exact same wording on the 2016 page => 2016 NC700X FEATURES - Honda
    Last edited by melensdad; 19th July 2019 at 13:51.

  5. #25
    Super Moderator Brake balance, NC750 SA 2016 670cc's Avatar
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    The definitions of linked and combined are not clear to me. On the 2012 and 2013, it was obvious what was going on, since the plumbing and hardware were right there to see.

    What would be interesting is to raise one wheel on a 2014-2019 ABS model, spin the wheel, and operate the brake for the other wheel to see if it has any effect on the spinning wheel. Are they linked in any way? Are they linked only if ABS is activated? Did the brake design change in 2014? In 2016?
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  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by 670cc View Post
    The definitions of linked and combined are not clear to me. On the 2012 and 2013, it was obvious what was going on, since the plumbing and hardware were right there to see.

    What would be interesting is to raise one wheel on a 2014-2019 ABS model, spin the wheel, and operate the brake for the other wheel to see if it has any effect on the spinning wheel. Are they linked in any way? Are they linked only if ABS is activated? Did the brake design change in 2014? In 2016?
    I don't think the linking or combining kicks on when ABS is activated.

    The way it was on the Harley street glide I sold a few months ago (linked ABS), there is a central ABS block that all brake lines ran through, that has electronic valves in it. The electronic valves are what controlls and proportions braking power. If memory serves me right, when applying the rear brake, it utilizes 100% of the rear brake and only the left front caliper (dual front brakes). When applying front brake, it utilizes both front brakes and something like 50% pressure goes to the rear brake, all controlled by this ABS block with electronic valves that control brake fluid flow.

    I am not sure how the NC's linked ABS system is made, I just hope like hell it's designed better than the Harley brake system. They make a big deal out of changing brake fluid at least every 2 years on those linked abs Harleys, because the valves in the ABS block can get gunked up and stick effectively locking up the brakes when you apply them. Several crashes reported as a result.

  7. #27
    Senior Member melensdad's Avatar
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    No clue about 2014-15 models; those were the previous generation. Newest generation started in 2016 with updated body plastics and newest DCT.

  8. #28
    Senior Member Brake balance, NC750 SA 2016
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    On my 13 "S" the link is from rear to front as 670 described where applying the rear brake moves one of the three pistons in the front. There is no relation to the ABS.

  9. #29
    Senior Member Brake balance, NC750 SA 2016
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    Perhaps the easiest way to determine if your NC has a linked system is to check the front caliper. If it has 3 pistons and 2 bleeder screws it's part of a linked system.

  10. #30
    Super Moderator Brake balance, NC750 SA 2016 670cc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DirtFlier View Post
    Perhaps the easiest way to determine if your NC has a linked system is to check the front caliper. If it has 3 pistons and 2 bleeder screws it's part of a linked system.
    If it’s that simple, and perhaps it is, then Honda is supplying false information on their web site for current 2019 models. The current web page claims that the 2019 ABS model’s brakes are linked, but we can see that the front caliper has two pistons and it’s fed by one brake hose.

    Maybe the 2019 model NC750X service manual would explain how this new linked brake system works. I don’t happen to have that manual to check it out.
    Last edited by 670cc; 20th July 2019 at 05:24.
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