Lugging Feel Under 3,000 RPM

Is it normal for the 750 to have a stutter type feel under 3,000 rpm at say half throttle and above? Makes me want to shift it down. A little annoying say around 95kmh and you want to be in 6th gear but it does the lugging feel. There was a thead here that talked about a bad injector or is this a normal characteristic of the motor?

Ruggybuggy said:

Is it normal for the 750 to have a stutter type feel under 3,000 rpm at say half throttle and above? Makes me want to shift it down. A little annoying say around 95kmh and you want to be in 6th gear but it does the lugging feel. There was a thead here that talked about a bad injector or is this a normal characteristic of the motor?

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Based on what you are describing, I would suspect that you have a bad injector. Many of us here in the US have NC700Xs, the 750 cannot be very much different.

I looked at the specifications of both of these bikes and all I can find is that each cylinder was 4 mm more on the bore diameter. Both the strokes and compression ratios are the same. There's no mention of the diameter of the throttle body that is used on the NC750X, I am assuming that it is also 36 mm. Therefore the bikes should behave in the same manner.

Lugging is a sign that engine is not getting enough fuel or there's an issue with the ignition. Remove your spark plugs and look at the color of the deposit coating near and around the electrode. Using this chart to ad you with your diagnostics, Common Spark Plug Conditons.

Not doubting you but the bike is only 5 months old and it's done it from new so it would have to be a defect from the start.

If some other 750 owners could chime in. If it's not normal then I may need to talk to Honda.

Are you sure you are not simply feeling this lugging as the naturally low revving engine?

I have the 750 and it's the lowest revving/most torquey bike I've ever ridden.

Are you comparing the NC to your previous bike, whatever that was it probably wasn't as torquey.

Just a thought.

My 700 has the same feeling but at lower rpm's (around 2500rpm). I think anytime you give it too much gas at a lower rpm it will feel like that. I just went through a tank of gas purposely riding slower and switching gears around 3500 rpms - just to see what my mpg's would be. Now, I am not giving it as much throttle in the lower rpm range but instead, just easing it into the more "gas friendly" range. That helps.
So, in my case, I think I was expecting too much from the lower rpm range. I agree with jelly's first sentence (with me, anyway).

One of the reasons I put the danmoto slipon on my NC was:
* my gut told me it was lugging below 3K and it felt like I was hurting parts
* but my brain told me the engine was intended to be run that way

With the barky muffler on it I can hear the engine is entirely happy to pull at low RPM down to 1500 or so. My "OMG it's lugging!" anxiety has been soothed.

Jelly said:

Are you sure you are not simply feeling this lugging as the naturally low revving engine?

I have the 750 and it's the lowest revving/most torquey bike I've ever ridden.

Are you comparing the NC to your previous bike, whatever that was it probably wasn't as torquey.

Just a thought.

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Previous bike was a modified FZ1 which has more torque and HP than I could possibly use. Not comparing the two, just trying to determain if this shudder feel is normal for the 750. I read a few previous posts that this condition is normal for the 700 but the 750 has dual balance shafts and I thought it should be smoother. Brillot2000 is suggesting it may be an injector issue and has successfully cured his problem by replacing them. Has anyone else done the injector replacement? Is this a normal characteristic of the 750? The bike is running very well and the gas mileage has been great but just has the shudder under 3,000 rpm and is most noticeable in 6th gear at full throttle in the lower rpm (2,700 and under). If this is a normal characteristic of the 270 degree crank so be it. If not I want it fixed.

Mine lugged quite badly when I swapped out the air filter, then it seemed to adjust itself after a couple of rides to a tolerable and apparently characteristic lug.
The same thing happened when I removed the cat but when I changed the silencer I didn't notice any extra lugging for any amount of time, actually I think it instantly smoothed it out a little more.

Ruggybuggy said:

Brillot2000 is suggesting it may be an injector issue and has successfully cured his problem by replacing them. Has anyone else done the injector replacement?

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"Scorpuco" stopped by this AM so we could double-check his rear caliper. It's nice to have two bikes side-by-side to make comparisons. Anyway, we removed the caliper, checked everything out, bolted it back up, then re-torqued the axle nut (the shop who patched his tire used an impact gun), checked chain slack .. all looks good.

BTW, if anyone has a 2012 and you're curious if your chain has been replaced under a recall, go here and enter your VIN #
Honda 2012 NC Chain Recall

During our various conversations, we discussed the "lugging" issue. He stated he has a shudder in the 65mph+ in top gear.

I have the issue in the upper gears under load, mostly at 45mph+. I haven't replaced the injectors, but my next plan of attack is to remove the injectors and give them a good clean.

And now that I'm thinking about this, I should use my infrared thermometer and check both heads and the exhaust pipe (just out of the head) - that should give me some clues.

But are you chasing your tail? Maybe this is normal for a 270 degree crank?

Ruggybuggy said:

But are you chasing your tail? Maybe this is normal for a 270 degree crank?

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Check my response here

Well, I think I'm going to run a good injector cleaner through a full tank and see if there's any diff.

caldercay- I really got hyped up and ready to change out my injectors after reading your "Fixed it" post. But, I just can't afford to goout and get some injectors right now. Mine is very smooth within a certain range of rpm and I keep there. (3000-4000)

[/QUOTE]
I removed the cat [/QUOTE]

I recall a kit available in order to remove the CAT. Is that what you did?

I went into the can to remove the CAT from a F800ST and was very pleased with the crisper throttle response as a result.

I removed the cat [/QUOTE]

I recall a kit available in order to remove the CAT. Is that what you did?

I went into the can to remove the CAT from a F800ST and was very pleased with the crisper throttle response as a result.[/QUOTE]


I don't think you should remove the cat from the NC. It's a low rev torque motor and removing the cat would probably hurt performance.

OK, haven't mentioned this yet but I'm an automotive technician. When I get back to work (I'm on holiday and touring right now) I'm going to scope the injector patterns and see if there are any abnormalities in the pattern. I might as well get a KV reading. If everything looks good then it's the motors characteristic and to verify I know my dealer has a 750 on the floor and I'll take it for a ride and see how it behaves.

itlives said:

caldercay- I really got hyped up and ready to change out my injectors after reading your "Fixed it" post. But, I just can't afford to goout and get some injectors right now. Mine is very smooth within a certain range of rpm and I keep there. (3000-4000)

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That's not my thread .... I just stated I have the same symptoms ... wouldn't surprise me if it's an injector.

i won't replace any until after I clean them first

When I say removed the cat I mean I fitted a Leo Vince de-cat pipe.

I was mostly told I'd notice gains and I did, also somebody said that if I was to fit an aftermarket silencer I'd notice a loss in bottom end performance, totally untrue.

Not sure if my experience is different to others because my bike is a DCT but at every modification stage (air filter, de-cat and silencer) I've noticed respectable gains that I'm very happy with, quite a relief because before I did my last exhaust mod I thought about selling my new NC because I felt it wasn't powerful enough.

I need to fab a stop up for my center stand so I can get my danmoto muffler back on. It improved fuel economy just slightly, but the biggest thing for me was it made the engine make more sense. With the stock pipe I'm always hitting the rev limiter and running higher rpms in general, but with the danmoto I rode it more like the v-twin bikes I've owned, because that's how it acts and wants to be ridden. I never hit the rev limiter with it on, I short shift it, accelerate completely different, etc. Another example is the false impression of lugging the engine the stock can gives you, running in top gear at say 2000rpm seems like the engine is struggling with it, but with a louder muffler all that just makes sense and I find the engine is actually pretty happy with it. Kinda hard to explain I guess.

In reply to the comments on the decat, it is the best single mod I have done to my bike and makes much more sense than a new exhaust. Really woke the bike up and sounds better, cost me much less than a new exhaust, runs cooler, and I get even better mileage. I also took someone's advice which lead me to buy it, and it is one of the few times listening to someone paid off! Don't knock it till you try it, the cat in the NC really chokes the bike. I have the Leo Vince decat, but Arrow also makes one. No other engine mods right now (stock exhaust and air filter).